Monarchs question

[BiggerDee]

As always, I did a search before contemplating this topic post, but came up empty.

I have some standard black box Monarchs, two groups purchased a long time apart. The group that is old has no seal under the cello. The recent batch has red seals on the tuck under the cello. Is there a significance for either the exclusion, or inclusion, of the seal, or is it a fluke?

Thanks in advance!

[Don Boyer]

As always, I did a search before contemplating this topic post, but came up empty.

I have some standard black box Monarchs, two groups purchased a long time apart. The group that is old has no seal under the cello. The recent batch has red seals on the tuck under the cello. Is there a significance for either the exclusion, or inclusion, of the seal, or is it a fluke?

Thanks in advance!

For the non-seal batch, where/when did you order them?

Just check the cellophane on them.  The "Gold Monarchs" use the same box, but the pull tab on the cellophane tear strip goes in the opposite direction as the standard Monarchs.  As far as the seal - probably an oversight.  Happens all the time, especially on custom decks.  Mine always had the red seals on them, but I recently got some Bohemias where one was lacking the custom seal.

[BiggerDee]

I bought the non-seal ones directly from T11, probably around when they came out. I added a pic to this post, I hope that it shows. Other than the seal, the boxes are identical except for one thing. The skull on the tuck flap is reversed between decks.

The "skull flip" is constant. All "seal" decks are positioned the same direction, while all "non-seal" decks are the opposite. I had never paid any attention to them but I just received a brick that had the red seals and when I added them to the others, that's when I noticed the difference,

[Don Boyer]

I bought the non-seal ones directly from T11, probably around when they came out. I added a pic to this post, I hope that it shows. Other than the seal, the boxes are identical except for one thing. The skull on the tuck flap is reversed between decks.

The "skull flip" is constant. All "seal" decks are positioned the same direction, while all "non-seal" decks are the opposite. I had never paid any attention to them but I just received a brick that had the red seals and when I added them to the others, that's when I noticed the difference,

If I'm not mistaken, a pull tab that's pulled to the back of the box is a standard Monarchs deck.  A pull tab that's pulled to the front is a Gold Monarchs.

As far as the seals, it was probably a simple manufacturing error.

As far as the box, perhaps they tweaked the box design for a subsequent print run?  It's been known to happen.

[BiggerDee]

I checked the pull strips by they are flattened so well that, without opening one, I can't tell which direction that they are going. I could understand the box tweak, it's just unusual that its the skull only. Either way, I like the tuck so that's a main reason that I buy them.

Thanks for your time and input, I appreciate it.

[Aaron]

I would guess that they are just from different print runs.

Also I think you should try the pull tab on one of the seal decks and see if they are regulars or Gold Monarchs. Even just pick it a tiny bit, or post a pic of the side of the box.

[Don Boyer]

I would guess that they are just from different print runs.

Also I think you should try the pull tab on one of the seal decks and see if they are regulars or Gold Monarchs. Even just pick it a tiny bit, or post a pic of the side of the box.

You don't need to actually pull the tab - just look carefully at which direction it would go when peeling it off.  Find the pull tab near the cellophane's sealed side edge - if the tab "points" in one direction, it will peel off in the other direction when being unwrapped.

[Aaron]

I would guess that they are just from different print runs.

Also I think you should try the pull tab on one of the seal decks and see if they are regulars or Gold Monarchs. Even just pick it a tiny bit, or post a pic of the side of the box.

You don't need to actually pull the tab - just look carefully at which direction it would go when peeling it off.  Find the pull tab near the cellophane's sealed side edge - if the tab "points" in one direction, it will peel off in the other direction when being unwrapped.

Ya thats why I wanted him to post a picture, because then if he cant tell maybe someone here can.

[Joshua Robinson]

My knowledge of this is that the ones with seals are the new ones designed with thinner Borders and the non seal ones are the old thick borders.

Just my 2 cents.

[BiggerDee]

Ok, now I'm just plain curious. I'll pick at it a bit and post a pic as well. Maybe I'll list the old ones, the "rare, exclusive, first run, "less than 5,000 decks made!!", error, best handling cards in the world" on eBay for $1,000 a deck! That seems like a reasonable price, doesn't it? ;-)

[Don Boyer]

Ok, now I'm just plain curious. I'll pick at it a bit and post a pic as well. Maybe I'll list the old ones, the "rare, exclusive, first run, "less than 5,000 decks made!!", error, best handling cards in the world" on eBay for $1,000 a deck! That seems like a reasonable price, doesn't it? ;-)

Sh'yeah...  You go do that... 

[BiggerDee]

Ok, I picked away at them and here's what I found. Although the sides are pretty much fused together, more so than the cello on a standard Bike deck, the both appear to open towards the back. In other words, if you look at the front, it seems like the strip would peel away from you. Both strips start on the left side. Another interesting thing is that then"red seal" deck has a MUCH heavier embossing on the tuck. It's most apparent in the leaves on the back. Check this relatively flat pic...the leaves are "domed/curved/embossed" much more. It's night and day in real life, far more so than even this pic indicates.

Also, the "banner" area on the front containing the Monarchs name, is deeply set on the "red seal" deck, and pretty much flat in the deck without the seal. So the "red seal" deck is deeply embossed, that the "no seal" deck is embossed, but you have to rub a finger across it to know that it isn't flat. Very interesting!

BTW...the "red seal" deck is in the right in both photos.

[Don Boyer]

All that could simply be the result of the second printing - it's very hard to get two different print runs completely identical when the deck in question has so many intricate details.  But yeah, you can tell the difference, for sure.

[BiggerDee]

Looking at the T11 site, the photo that they show is for the "flat" deck, not the super-embossed one. I need to buy some current batch ones from them to see what they look like, embossing-wise, just to satisfy my curiosity. Of course, that's probably the photo from day one, and that would match up with my older "flat" decks. I really love the heavily embossed tucks.

Little things that make collecting interesting!

[Don Boyer]

Looking at the T11 site, the photo that they show is for the "flat" deck, not the super-embossed one. I need to buy some current batch ones from them to see what they look like, embossing-wise, just to satisfy my curiosity. Of course, that's probably the photo from day one, and that would match up with my older "flat" decks. I really love the heavily embossed tucks.

Little things that make collecting interesting!

The on-site photos are almost certainly from day one - I rarely see these magic/designer guys update the photos for minor differences between print runs, sometimes not even for major ones.  Many of the older decks still on sale at Ellusionist have "archaic" markings such as "Cincinnati, Ohio 45212" or "UV500 Air-Flow Finish" on the tuck boxes in their display photos...