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Asking for suggestion

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Asking for suggestion
« on: November 09, 2013, 11:43:08 PM »
 

Colorless Concept

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Hello,

About the production of the deck ,I had found 3 company(USPS,prime,a Taiwan company  which can print the deck with a very good quality.But I cannot decided which company is the most suitable .I asking for suggestion of which type of company is suitable to use.
 

Re: Asking for suggestion
« Reply #1 on: November 10, 2013, 12:57:51 AM »
 

Don Boyer

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Hello,

About the production of the deck ,I had found 3 company(USPS,prime,a Taiwan company  which can print the deck with a very good quality.But I cannot decided which company is the most suitable .I asking for suggestion of which type of company is suitable to use.

You should do some reading up on this - there's an old expression about how opinions are like a$$holes - everyone has one, but most of them stink!  :))

Seriously, though, USPC is the market's 800-pound gorilla, the Microsoft or Google of playing cards.  A majority of collectors will collect only USPC-made decks, and many of those stick exclusively to the Bicycle brand name and nothing else.

But, having said that, just because they're the 800-pound gorilla, that doesn't make them the only game in town.  They got there for a reason, and that was consistent quality of product.  You would need to find a company that could at least meet if not exceed that level of quality, and you'd have to promote the hell out of it.  When Lawrence Sullivan released the Legends deck, a non-USPC deck he had made with an unknown printer in Taiwan, he sent advance copies of the decks to a group of people known for being respected for their opinions for the purposes of letting them review the cards, see how they perform and talk amongst the community about them.  His Legends decks went on to become a huge success, a very quick sell-out.  The quality was up there and the cards were very unique not just in handling but in the additional magic-related features he included in the design, making them in high demand for the low price he was selling them for.  He could afford to undercut the price of most USPC-made custom decks because his printer didn't charge the same high rates - but it was NOT the price alone that made that deck a hit.

Find out just what these other companies can produce.  Obtain samples from them, see how they perform compared to something like a pack of Bicycle Masters (they make for a good baseline deck for how well a custom deck should perform).  If they can't beat a pack of Masters, they're not likely to gain enough traction in the market no matter how hard you promote them.  But if they can, well...now the uphill battle begins.  Compare price with USPC, minimum print run size, additional features (things like metallic inks, embossed and foiled boxes, etc.) and see how it all stacks up.  If you find that the stars align just right and you can make a go of it, now you have to find ways to get this deck into the hearts and minds of the card-buying community.  There's no one fixed formula for that, but shooting a video of a cardist performing with one of the sample decks could help significantly, as well as getting people to evaluate them.  It's easier to do this with a self-funded deck, since you can have decks printed and hand out samples of your own work, but it's more risky and most people simply don't have the funds for it.  You will need to go out there, kissing babies and shaking hands, making everyone know what your deck is and what it can do, especially if you're planning on a Kickstarter project to get it off the ground.

To put it simply, it's not for the faint of heart to use an unknown printer to do the job.  For better or worse, most projects are made with USPC, especially those that aren't privately funded.

The only way you could easily get away with using another printer and be a success at it is if you're making an art deck, something that's created more for its attractiveness than for its performance characteristics.  With a deck like that, it's not mandatory to get the best print job in terms of performance, because you really want the best print job in terms of faithful reproduction of your images, making them look brilliant and beautiful - AND you'll want a company that will let you make a really short print run that won't cost too much per deck, because you'll be getting a much smaller number of backers.  Many decks have taken this route to success.
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Re: Asking for suggestion
« Reply #2 on: November 11, 2013, 06:22:24 AM »
 

Colorless Concept

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Thank Don,

I think I should more information about the company and use the most suitable one.
 

Re: Asking for suggestion
« Reply #3 on: November 16, 2013, 03:52:56 AM »
 

Colorless Concept

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Here are a sample of the concept art (This is just the 50 % of the design and may change it)
 

Re: Asking for suggestion
« Reply #4 on: November 16, 2013, 04:24:56 AM »
 

Don Boyer

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Here are a sample of the concept art (This is just the 50 % of the design and may change it)

Why show us a half-completed sample that's subject to change?  It's in no way representative of what the final work will look like if it's only half done and not even near the final concept.  We can't give advice, pointers or whatever it is you're seeking with only this piecemeal representation.  It's like me reviewing a book by reading a first draft of a few middle chapters or reviewing a movie by seeing the dailies of one week's worth of the footage shot scattered over a two-month period, or reviewing a painting by seeing the preliminary sketch work before any paint's been applied to the blank canvas.
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Re: Asking for suggestion
« Reply #5 on: November 16, 2013, 04:45:33 AM »
 

Colorless Concept

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Hi Don,

Actually the other 50% is the face cards and this is the back design of the deck.I know showing somethings incomplete is quite annoying but I just need some advice does this design look great or bad.
 

Re: Asking for suggestion
« Reply #6 on: November 16, 2013, 05:35:17 AM »
 

volantangel

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Bad. Straight up bad. Why just take clip art and smack it on a white bg. Any tom dick or harry can do that.
 

Re: Asking for suggestion
« Reply #7 on: November 16, 2013, 06:11:22 AM »
 

Don Boyer

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If that's your entire back design, yeah - it's missing something, big time.

You should consider hiring me.  I offer consulting services for playing card projects.  Send me a PM.
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Re: Asking for suggestion
« Reply #8 on: December 13, 2013, 10:13:42 AM »
 

Colorless Concept

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Hello Guys,this is a new version of the back design.But I need some suggestion to continuous to complete the entire design.
 

Re: Asking for suggestion
« Reply #9 on: December 13, 2013, 10:50:40 AM »
 

sprouts1115

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You have not broken any rules.  It's a "2-way" back, but people are going to say you have to much negative space.  The top left cornor is lacking.  That is what people are going to see in fans.  First, it seems you need to get the card die from the manufacture your going to go with.  That will help you gauge your deign to the cut border.  USPCC template is below.  http://www.bicyclecards.com/custom-playing-cards  Hope this helps.  I feel people are going to slam the door on you and not respond.  You need to make what you think a complete back is for people to comment. Are you planning on making something like this:  http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/search?utf8=✓&term=playing+card+flower ?
 

Re: Asking for suggestion
« Reply #10 on: December 13, 2013, 10:58:13 AM »
 

volantangel

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sprouts its one-way, the rose in the middle isnt two way. And the whole things looks clipart-ish, i dont think you will get anywhere with that design.
 

Re: Asking for suggestion
« Reply #11 on: December 13, 2013, 02:03:31 PM »
 

Don Boyer

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The overall design is a bit on the simple side without actually being minimalist.  Go look at some of the more classic deck backs as well as some of the newer custom backs.  Use that as a starting point design-wise and make it uniquely your own.  Don't stretch a design, just make it larger in the first place.  And don't make something that either is clip art or looks like clip art, because even if it isn't, people will assume that it is.  If you want negative space, make it so that it actually enhances the design instead of looking like it was coincidentally left because it was overlooked.
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Re: Asking for suggestion
« Reply #12 on: December 19, 2013, 01:10:29 AM »
 

Rob Wright

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I'm not a card designer, but I see what you're going for. Kind of a Rose Back theme. I would move the center rose up and add a second one down flipped 180 to make sure it is a true 2 way fill in the middle with the vines- add a few small roses on the vines around. Lay it on a poker card die to see how it fills out. The red needs a contrasting color behind it. Maybe some kind of a light and dark grey fine pattern in the background. Something to break up the emptiness.
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Re: Asking for suggestion
« Reply #13 on: January 02, 2014, 07:18:34 AM »
 

Colorless Concept

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Here are little update of the back design.I think I put a logo inside the middle ,may design one.
 

Re: Asking for suggestion
« Reply #14 on: January 02, 2014, 08:24:19 AM »
 

Don Boyer

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Here are little update of the back design.I think I put a logo inside the middle ,may design one.

Instead of making solid black vines and leaves, why not actually draw them with detail and correct color?  It would look so much more attractive.  As it is, it still looks like a stretched-out piece of clip art.  And why are the roses blue?
« Last Edit: January 02, 2014, 08:25:09 AM by Don Boyer »
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Re: Asking for suggestion
« Reply #15 on: January 04, 2014, 07:06:27 AM »
 

Colorless Concept

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How about this design
 

Re: Asking for suggestion
« Reply #16 on: January 04, 2014, 08:31:06 AM »
 

Don Boyer

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How about this design

Reread the advice you've been given by us thus far.  So far, you've taken very little of it to heart - the overall look of the back from start to finish has been stretched-out clip art, and you keep adding more clip art as if this would improve matters.  You asked for help, we gave it to you, then you ignored most of what we said, did your own thing and you continue asking for help - no offense, but at this point, the problem might be with the designer as well as the design.  I can't see where we'd be able to help you any further right now.

Some closing advice: look at the works of some of the top designers on Kickstarter - Shane Tyree, Uusi, Encarded, Midnight Playing Cards, Kings Wild, just to name a few.  Do you have to mimic them?  We would hope you wouldn't.  But should you at least strive for that kind of creativity instead of making Cut, Paste, Mirror and Stretch your primary designing tools?  By all means, yes!  Maybe you should try putting down the keyboard and the mouse and picking up a pad and some pencils and see what you can come up with on your own, without access to clip art.
« Last Edit: January 04, 2014, 08:31:55 AM by Don Boyer »
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