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NEW DECK - Bicycle Spectrum -- Kickstarter completed!

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Re: NEW DECK - Bicycle Spectrum -- Kickstarter is ACTIVE!
« Reply #175 on: February 25, 2012, 09:56:04 PM »
 

loldudex2

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I'll be posting the proof of the uncut when I get it sometime this coming week...

the routine that will be on the DVD will use the rainbow card(s) you saw, so at this time there's at least one of the rainbow cards.

I've come up with a couple other routines which could use a double backer, so the gaffs are still being decided.



The art dept. is working on the setting up the colors right now, so I have this weekend to make up my mind about the gaffs. 
The gaffs are based on the routines for the DVD.

I'm just going to say this. If the battle between the deck is to make the gaffs functional, or the uncut look good, the Magic should come first.
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Re: NEW DECK - Bicycle Spectrum -- Kickstarter is ACTIVE!
« Reply #176 on: February 25, 2012, 11:41:50 PM »
 

Cosmo Solano

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Woohoo! Just hit 12k! 400%!
 

Re: NEW DECK - Bicycle Spectrum -- Kickstarter is ACTIVE!
« Reply #177 on: February 25, 2012, 11:49:40 PM »
 

dmbaggs

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Woohoo! Just hit 12k! 400%!

Awesome! Are you adding anything on or doing anything with the extra funds?
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Re: NEW DECK - Bicycle Spectrum -- Kickstarter is ACTIVE!
« Reply #178 on: February 26, 2012, 01:14:03 AM »
 

Russell CircleCityCards

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I'm just going to say this. If the battle between the deck is to make the gaffs functional, or the uncut look good, the Magic should come first.


Yeah, but there are a million gaff possibilities...  and as much as I love Lance Miller's Actuators, the uncut is really marred by the 3 of spades on the back side.


How many other chances do we have of having a perfect 808 back uncut with 56 different colors?  this could be the ONE, and I am really hopeful for that.  It would be an amazing collectors piece.
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Re: NEW DECK - Bicycle Spectrum -- Kickstarter is ACTIVE!
« Reply #179 on: February 26, 2012, 02:12:20 AM »
 

Aaron

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I'm just going to say this. If the battle between the deck is to make the gaffs functional, or the uncut look good, the Magic should come first.


Yeah, but there are a million gaff possibilities...  and as much as I love Lance Miller's Actuators, the uncut is really marred by the 3 of spades on the back side.


How many other chances do we have of having a perfect 808 back uncut with 56 different colors?  this could be the ONE, and I am really hopeful for that.  It would be an amazing collectors piece.
I do agree that a uncut of this deck would be awesome. I may think about getting one but idk. The thing about uncuts is I don`t like how they dont cost much more than a regular deck to get but they cost 5x the deck price to buy. This is with all uncuts not just this one.
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Re: NEW DECK - Bicycle Spectrum -- Kickstarter is ACTIVE!
« Reply #180 on: February 26, 2012, 02:22:53 AM »
 

Don Boyer

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Black-and-white or sepia tuck box: interesting idea but doesn't help sell the deck much.  The current box gives the buyer an idea of its contents more effectively.  IF you saw it sitting on the shelf at your local magic shop, you'd have a very clear idea of what kind of deck it was.  I like the black background on this box, actually - it reminds me of the Pink Floyd album cover for "Dark Side of the Moon".

The argument for a 56-card spectrum uncut sheet is a good one - but it doesn't trump the fact that this is a deck first (and a magic deck at that), an uncut sheet second.  If there's a few different cards needed, in particular one or two with a rainbow back, so be it.  He's not making the deck because he thought it would be cool for collectors to have a wicked-looking uncut sheet; he's making it because it's a commercial-grade version of a deck that he previously had to make by hand in order to perform some of his magic tricks.

While I fully recognize that a poster isn't the same as an uncut sheet, he has created two different posters that show off only cards in different shades of color, with no rainbow backs or unsightly gaff cards - it won't have the collector's value, but it will have the beauty that an uncut sheet with that layout would have.  And it's not as hard on the wallet to get, either!
« Last Edit: February 26, 2012, 02:23:46 AM by Don Boyer »
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Re: NEW DECK - Bicycle Spectrum -- Kickstarter is ACTIVE!
« Reply #181 on: February 26, 2012, 10:09:39 AM »
 

Cosmo Solano

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Black-and-white or sepia tuck box: interesting idea but doesn't help sell the deck much.  The current box gives the buyer an idea of its contents more effectively.  IF you saw it sitting on the shelf at your local magic shop, you'd have a very clear idea of what kind of deck it was.  I like the black background on this box, actually - it reminds me of the Pink Floyd album cover for "Dark Side of the Moon".

The argument for a 56-card spectrum uncut sheet is a good one - but it doesn't trump the fact that this is a deck first (and a magic deck at that), an uncut sheet second.  If there's a few different cards needed, in particular one or two with a rainbow back, so be it.  He's not making the deck because he thought it would be cool for collectors to have a wicked-looking uncut sheet; he's making it because it's a commercial-grade version of a deck that he previously had to make by hand in order to perform some of his magic tricks.

While I fully recognize that a poster isn't the same as an uncut sheet, he has created two different posters that show off only cards in different shades of color, with no rainbow backs or unsightly gaff cards - it won't have the collector's value, but it will have the beauty that an uncut sheet with that layout would have.  And it's not as hard on the wallet to get, either!

Don, you are a gentleman and a scholar!!  I couldn't have put it more perfectly! 

Please guys, read Don's post regarding this.  Please, it's simple... only purchase the uncut sheet if you like it!  The poster looks AWESOME!

BTW, the proof will be posted soon, then you can decide.  I have had much input on this, and more people like the rainbow/gaff SHOWING on the backs side of the uncut sheet than the front!  I can't go back and forth anymore and will have to make the decision based on what I feel is best. 

when it's all said and done, there will be just a fraction of uncuts produced, no where NEAR the number of decks.  They are what they are...

Thanks again!!
 

Re: NEW DECK - Bicycle Spectrum -- Kickstarter is ACTIVE!
« Reply #182 on: February 26, 2012, 10:10:55 AM »
 

Cosmo Solano

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A BIG thank you to all of you who pledged the kickstarter SPECTRUM deck project!

SOLD OUT OF THE GOLD SEAL DECKS! (please read the backers update for details)

WOW! Thanks again and again and again.......

coz
 

Re: NEW DECK - Bicycle Spectrum -- Kickstarter is ACTIVE!
« Reply #183 on: February 26, 2012, 11:22:36 AM »
 

NathanCanadas

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Hey Cosmo, I think the Gold and Black Seals is a great idea! Glad I got 3 gold ones. Also, I upped my pledge to get an additional black one!
 

Re: NEW DECK - Bicycle Spectrum -- Kickstarter is ACTIVE!
« Reply #184 on: February 26, 2012, 11:31:30 AM »
 

Evan

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Just saying, I think the gold and black seal is dumb... whats the point? Why not have more gold seal or more black seal?
 

Re: NEW DECK - Bicycle Spectrum -- Kickstarter is ACTIVE!
« Reply #185 on: February 26, 2012, 02:10:27 PM »
 

Cosmo Solano

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Just saying, I think the gold and black seal is dumb... whats the point? Why not have more gold seal or more black seal?
the gold seal black seal thing doesn't hurt anyone, playing cards are not printed 1 deck at a time, they are printed in runs, which really is only important to the collector, if you're getting the deck to open and use then it doesn't really matter what seal is on it. it's like first edition printing of books.  so there's really nothing dumb or smart about it. if the seals don't matter to you than it has no bearing.  the good news is that those who would like the deck can still get it thanks to the second run.  A commitment has to be made as to how many decks are being printed,if more or wanted or needed any second run has to be ordered .  the collector likes to know whether or not they're getting the first or second run that's really all the seals are for, identification.
 

Re: NEW DECK - Bicycle Spectrum -- Kickstarter is ACTIVE!
« Reply #186 on: February 26, 2012, 02:24:36 PM »
 

dmbaggs

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Just saying, I think the gold and black seal is dumb... whats the point? Why not have more gold seal or more black seal?
the gold seal black seal thing doesn't hurt anyone, playing cards are not printed 1 deck at a time, they are printed in runs, which really is only important to the collector, if you're getting the deck to open and use then it doesn't really matter what seal is on it. it's like first edition printing of books.  so there's really nothing dumb or smart about it. if the seals don't matter to you than it has no bearing.  the good news is that those who would like the deck can still get it thanks to the second run.  A commitment has to be made as to how many decks are being printed,if more or wanted or needed any second run has to be ordered .  the collector likes to know whether or not they're getting the first or second run that's really all the seals are for, identification.

I think the gold/black seal is pretty cool actually! I'm glad that there is a difference in the two runs as well. I might have to up for a black seal deck as well! Thanks for the update
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Re: NEW DECK - Bicycle Spectrum -- Kickstarter is ACTIVE!
« Reply #187 on: February 26, 2012, 04:03:55 PM »
 

hazofhorsham

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Meh I see the point of the seal difference but in my opinion there's no real reason for it. The idea you have is that only collectors will care whether it is first, or second printing and that's why the seal is different - I don't think we (speaking as a collector myself) do care as this deck has very minimal collecting quality. No offense meant but you know why I got mine - the attracting thing to me is the different colours... It's great for magic and flourishing - but in terms of what collectors look for:
-Big name reputable company (this is your first deck)
-Few available (as soon as they ran out you said you'd print more)
-Intrinsic and time heavy design (it's just the riderback design coloured)
-Unbuyable (Gold arcane cough... In matter of fact we are half funding these)
-Specifically Designed for collectors (Red artifice etc, these were designed for magicians)
-Not designed to be sold (some magic decks make it big in the collecting world)


So like I say nice design, but apart from the bicycle name I don't think this is ever going to be collectable.
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Re: NEW DECK - Bicycle Spectrum -- Kickstarter is ACTIVE!
« Reply #188 on: February 26, 2012, 04:41:48 PM »
 

Cosmo Solano

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Great points hazaofhorsham, not a collector myself, nor having the ability to see the future, I'm just doing things the best I can in a way that's no harm either way.  A second run will happen no matter what color the seal is, so why not change the color just for reference sake?  Should the deck not be collectible then the seals won't matter anyway, should they become collectible, the seals will have been a good idea.  No harm no foul either way.  I spent many hours in discussion and planning of this deck, not with magicians as you might think, since it's initial reason is for magic and that's my area of expertise, but with some heavy hitter collectors.  Hands down the advice to me was: limit the first run to 2500, which was all my budget could handle anyway, and in the event that the demand calls for more cards, identify the second run in some way, the seal being the most recommended.

I love the discussion but gold seal, black seal, pink seal, polka dotted seal, really doesn't hurt anything but does offer the identifier for those who might want it. I say if it means nothing to you tear it open and have some fun with them!   And by the way with all the respect for your experience in the world, I'm told quite the opposite about the collect-ability of the cards. Just like the box, the uncuts, and the gaffs, I get 6 of one, 1/2 a dozen of the other.  Of course theirs are just opinions as well... who knows?

to each his own! 

Who'd have thought a crappy little plastic cracker jack toy that most people threw away could ever be worth thousands?  Personally, and in all honesty, I'm  just happy that I'll FINALLY have the deck in my hands to use!

-best!

Coz
 

Re: NEW DECK - Bicycle Spectrum -- Kickstarter is ACTIVE!
« Reply #189 on: February 26, 2012, 05:07:14 PM »
 

Cosmo Solano

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Thanks Nathan! And again thanks brown_baggs for everything!

coz
 

Re: NEW DECK - Bicycle Spectrum -- Kickstarter is ACTIVE!
« Reply #190 on: February 27, 2012, 12:24:08 AM »
 

Don Boyer

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Meh I see the point of the seal difference but in my opinion there's no real reason for it. The idea you have is that only collectors will care whether it is first, or second printing and that's why the seal is different - I don't think we (speaking as a collector myself) do care as this deck has very minimal collecting quality. No offense meant but you know why I got mine - the attracting thing to me is the different colours... It's great for magic and flourishing - but in terms of what collectors look for:
-Big name reputable company (this is your first deck)
-Few available (as soon as they ran out you said you'd print more)
-Intrinsic and time heavy design (it's just the riderback design coloured)
-Unbuyable (Gold arcane cough... In matter of fact we are half funding these)
-Specifically Designed for collectors (Red artifice etc, these were designed for magicians)
-Not designed to be sold (some magic decks make it big in the collecting world)


So like I say nice design, but apart from the bicycle name I don't think this is ever going to be collectable.

I have to differ with you on the points you've raised.

Some magicians actually do collect tricks as collectible items as well as useful props.  To them, yes, there would be a difference in the first and second printings, just as there would be to card collectors in a "regular" custom playing card deck.

The other points:

- Big name reputable company
     Apparently you aren't familiar with his work in creating card magic tricks and devices.  He is a known name, not someone out of the blue.  I own his Joker Monte, though I haven't quite mastered it yet, as well as one or two other tricks he's created!  I'm not sure what magic decks he may have made before, but he has a good deal of experience in making cards just from the assorted gaffs he's had created.

- Few available
     The first run is indeed a limited run.  The second is not an infinite run, either.  Both runs combined are only 5,000 decks - fewer than some D&D decks, I'd wager, and both runs are equal in quantity to a single print run of some of the rarer new decks on the market, like every single rare deck made by Ellusionist, the Black New Fan Backs, and so on.

- Intrinsic and Time-Heavy Design
     The cards are still being tweaked, the box was redesigned twice, selecting the right shades may sound easy but it's not, and the work involved in printing this must be insane in terms of different inks and printing plates needed.  I would guess this is a five-to-seven-color job including black and spot colors.  It's not the most difficult deck ever made, but it wasn't like he took a stroll in his garden in the morning, decided "Hey, I'll make a deck today!," and had a finished design by dinner time.
     If you count handmade prototypes, he's spent over TWENTY YEARS working on this deck's design and functionality as a magic deck.  It's not just the pretty shapes and colors, it's how it works in front of the spectators that went into the design of this deck.

- Unbuyable
     With only 5,000 decks made in both print runs, and the first run of 2,500 already sold out before the first deck's been printed, you won't exactly be finding this in Kmarts across the country...  Even the Gold Arcane you referenced in your example is "buyable", just not from Ellusionist.  Unbuyable would be an ancient Chinese deck from the first millennium CE which resides in a PRC museum, not Gold Arcane!

- Specifically Designed for collectors (Red artifice etc, these were designed for magicians)
     First, as stated earlier, some people do collect magic props - this would be one of them.  Second, they're not available in unlimited quantities, which is another thing that gets a collector's juices going.
     Lastly, the Artifice deck v.1 was NOT "specifically designed for collectors", in either color.  Every deck Ellusionist's made, even the limited-edition decks, were meant to be functional magic and cardistry decks as well as (with the exception of all the gaffed decks) a good set of playing cards.  Otherwise, why bother with things like Magic Finish?  If it never leaves the box and sits on a collector's shelf, the finish could be made of sandpaper and you'd never know the difference.
     Collectibility is something the market determines, not something built into the design from the beginning - those who try making a deck collectible from the start with inadequate foundation for it to be so (Mismag822/AFCCC's "there's only five" decks, the Big Gun decks) don't usually fare very well.  You can't sit there with a straight face and tell me that a 1920s Racer Back deck, a pack of Jerry's Nugget, a deck of pre-USPCC Arrcos or even a pack of Smoke v.1 was "specifically designed for collectors", but they are all highly sought-after by them.

- Not designed to be sold
     This baffles me.  There are the giveaway limited-edition/premium decks like Ellusionist has.  But are you trying to say that Smoke & Mirrors v.1 were NOT DESIGNED TO BE SOLD? Or any of the above-mentioned collectible decks, with the exception of "premium" decks like E's rarities?  Think about this statement for a moment...

If you don't like the difference seal colors, more power to you - you're not being forced to buy the deck with either seal on it.  But as I see it, your statements about what makes a deck collectible are just plain wrong.
« Last Edit: February 27, 2012, 12:34:24 AM by Don Boyer »
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Re: NEW DECK - Bicycle Spectrum -- Kickstarter is ACTIVE!
« Reply #191 on: February 27, 2012, 01:56:13 PM »
 

hazofhorsham

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LONG POST - READ IF INTERESTED OR DON... :)

Meh I see the point of the seal difference but in my opinion there's no real reason for it. The idea you have is that only collectors will care whether it is first, or second printing and that's why the seal is different - I don't think we (speaking as a collector myself) do care as this deck has very minimal collecting quality. No offense meant but you know why I got mine - the attracting thing to me is the different colours... It's great for magic and flourishing - but in terms of what collectors look for:
-Big name reputable company (this is your first deck)
-Few available (as soon as they ran out you said you'd print more)
-Intrinsic and time heavy design (it's just the riderback design coloured)
-Unbuyable (Gold arcane cough... In matter of fact we are half funding these)
-Specifically Designed for collectors (Red artifice etc, these were designed for magicians)
-Not designed to be sold (some magic decks make it big in the collecting world)


So like I say nice design, but apart from the bicycle name I don't think this is ever going to be collectable.

I have to differ with you on the points you've raised.

Some magicians actually do collect tricks as collectible items as well as useful props.  To them, yes, there would be a difference in the first and second printings, just as there would be to card collectors in a "regular" custom playing card deck.

The other points:

- Big name reputable company
     Apparently you aren't familiar with his work in creating card magic tricks and devices.  He is a known name, not someone out of the blue.  I own his Joker Monte, though I haven't quite mastered it yet, as well as one or two other tricks he's created!  I'm not sure what magic decks he may have made before, but he has a good deal of experience in making cards just from the assorted gaffs he's had created.

- Few available
     The first run is indeed a limited run.  The second is not an infinite run, either.  Both runs combined are only 5,000 decks - fewer than some D&D decks, I'd wager, and both runs are equal in quantity to a single print run of some of the rarer new decks on the market, like every single rare deck made by Ellusionist, the Black New Fan Backs, and so on.

- Intrinsic and Time-Heavy Design
     The cards are still being tweaked, the box was redesigned twice, selecting the right shades may sound easy but it's not, and the work involved in printing this must be insane in terms of different inks and printing plates needed.  I would guess this is a five-to-seven-color job including black and spot colors.  It's not the most difficult deck ever made, but it wasn't like he took a stroll in his garden in the morning, decided "Hey, I'll make a deck today!," and had a finished design by dinner time.
     If you count handmade prototypes, he's spent over TWENTY YEARS working on this deck's design and functionality as a magic deck.  It's not just the pretty shapes and colors, it's how it works in front of the spectators that went into the design of this deck.

- Unbuyable
     With only 5,000 decks made in both print runs, and the first run of 2,500 already sold out before the first deck's been printed, you won't exactly be finding this in Kmarts across the country...  Even the Gold Arcane you referenced in your example is "buyable", just not from Ellusionist.  Unbuyable would be an ancient Chinese deck from the first millennium CE which resides in a PRC museum, not Gold Arcane!

- Specifically Designed for collectors (Red artifice etc, these were designed for magicians)
     First, as stated earlier, some people do collect magic props - this would be one of them.  Second, they're not available in unlimited quantities, which is another thing that gets a collector's juices going.
     Lastly, the Artifice deck v.1 was NOT "specifically designed for collectors", in either color.  Every deck Ellusionist's made, even the limited-edition decks, were meant to be functional magic and cardistry decks as well as (with the exception of all the gaffed decks) a good set of playing cards.  Otherwise, why bother with things like Magic Finish?  If it never leaves the box and sits on a collector's shelf, the finish could be made of sandpaper and you'd never know the difference.
     Collectibility is something the market determines, not something built into the design from the beginning - those who try making a deck collectible from the start with inadequate foundation for it to be so (Mismag822/AFCCC's "there's only five" decks, the Big Gun decks) don't usually fare very well.  You can't sit there with a straight face and tell me that a 1920s Racer Back deck, a pack of Jerry's Nugget, a deck of pre-USPCC Arrcos or even a pack of Smoke v.1 was "specifically designed for collectors", but they are all highly sought-after by them.

- Not designed to be sold
     This baffles me.  There are the giveaway limited-edition/premium decks like Ellusionist has.  But are you trying to say that Smoke & Mirrors v.1 were NOT DESIGNED TO BE SOLD? Or any of the above-mentioned collectible decks, with the exception of "premium" decks like E's rarities?  Think about this statement for a moment...

If you don't like the difference seal colors, more power to you - you're not being forced to buy the deck with either seal on it.  But as I see it, your statements about what makes a deck collectible are just plain wrong.




I appreciate that magicians create tricks - but magic trick vs card collectors? I would say there are more playing card collectors - and would reason this with the fact that big name magicians (DB, D&D, and the likes) go into the card market once they establish a name - lee asher is the same. It's okay to say that these magicians started their card line as their personal props but let's face it if you make a deck of cards as a prop you wouldn't produce a whole line? Maybe just a couple, each an improvement on the last, for example DB relaesed the Tally Ho lions, bee split spades, split spades lions, white lions - all in different colors. I have seem some mad trick collectors - with libraries full of books and props. Again I appreciate that he is a relatively big name in magic, but in terms of the whole magic and card community I am not overly sure. Please don't think I am just being negative I am just trying to be realistic - you may have your own opinion and that is fine, you obviously know of him because you have an earlier trick. Also, this isn't the first normal deck to rainbow trick. Magic makers did a similiar trick as well.


Big name reputable company?
Again I am not saying he isn't known in magic - I am saying he isn't known for his cards. I mean I wouldn't buy a E deck based on their magic selection? If they make a gaff dvd it could have some of the best sleights and tricks on it but I have no idea of the quality of the cards and so I wouldn't immediatly start collecting. If they produce a few and you think "Wow these are amazing" then the next few decks you will start collecting. This is true for any new area you are breaching into.


Few avaliable?
2,500 decks is a limited run agreed but a deck is only as limited as it's design run AND it's distribution. Look at the BG1E - the first lot were a run of 5,000 - but you couldn't get them. If you could buy them they wouldn't be rare. It took about 4 years to get all of them into circulation - where as this deck will be to the public by the end of the summer (my bet). To make a deck truly rare doesn't just mean a limited run, it meant limiting the AVALIABLITY. There is a difference. Would you say the Bicycle Pirate Decks were rare? By your logic they are, and I would add that their rarity is even higher as they come in sets. Furthermore, the distribution of this deck can't be controlled... It is available to everyone with a credit card (sorry paypal guys) who heard about it. Again it's the whole avalibility isn't just the number of decks.


Intrinsic and Time-Heavy Design?
I admit the is probably my fault - I by no means meant to say this deck was a cop out. I wasn't saying Coz had speant no time - I was saying that the designs that are successfully rare are new and abstract - they challenge cards. Gold Arcanes aren't just limited - they are beautiful cards. I am not saying this spectrum isnt awesome - but the riderback isn't a new creative design. I think what Cos has done is amazing. But for this trick to work the cards have to be common, he said so himself.


Unbuyable?
Again these are readily avaliable. They are on kickstarter and if you argue - like you did earlier - that the second run will also be limited, well it's still out there. I mean I had a couple of weeks to decide whether to get this 'collectible' deck - and that diminshes the point. Also I think you are forgetting the fundamentals about kickstarter - one of the biggest boost is a reseller buying a load of decks - Cos has sold 5 of his top three packages, which are aimed at resellers. One bought 300 decks - they will appear all over the place in large numbers. Again diminishing the collectibility. I can't emphasize enough that it's the avalibility of the cards.


Specifically designed for collectors?
This isn't. Fact. I mean it's a limited run and everything - but from what I have read from Coz, he doesn't want this to be collectible. He has said time and time again "I want people to like the magic" "the deck is a trick, it's for magicians". He has spent a lot of time and effort making the dvd to show the trick. He wants it performed, not on a shelf for someone to go in twenty years time "this was a great trick, I wanted to keep it all intact". I get the impression he likes the look of broken and used decks. In my opinion he isn't in the market of extorting collectors... No mentions D&D. The red artifice decks were designed to be highly sort after, same as BG1E and gold arcanes. Yeah they look awesome and have functioning magic capabilities but you know they are made for for collectors. You know it's marketing. If a deck isn't designed to be collectible - can you tell me why E would authorize a 5000 deck run (costing around $15,000) to not be sold? The thing with the the finish and quality of the decks? That's for the reason I stated earlier? E can do things like that because they are a big name and have people who will vouch for their quality. A deck has to be of high quality - otherwise people wouldn't collect it. Jerry's were unknown and worthless... A few magicians use them and are like "Wow these are great for the flourishes we do" and bang - instantly collectible. Agreed collectibility is something the market determines - but at the base it is supply vs demand. Increase the demand and decrease the supply proportionaltly increases the collectibility. A crap deck that looks horrible would be lucky to sell a 100. A great deck looking beautiful from a big name with good marketing would sell loads... But if loads aren't availible people get desperate and pay higher giving higher prices and you can see where it gets.


Not designed to be sold?
I wasn't on about E or D&D. I mean that some decks aren't sold at all. I believe early DB decks were his to use, I know the sepia split spades lions were his personal stash. Also I know other magicians who create a deck for their show - they aren't going to sell the deck sometimes it's a giveaway to their customers, others it's just a few left over (the card ninja in japan did this, green tally ho I believe was a similar thing)


You seem to be under the impression I meant a collectible deck falls under all of these areas - no, it just normally falls under a few. Go on name a rare deck, and try not to fit it under a catergory?


In essence my argument says two facts in a detailed more round about way:


1. Few avaliable (in the unbuyable, not design to be sold and few avaliable)
2. High demand (Big name reputable company, intrinsic and time heavy design, designed for collectors)


As I stated above it is a simple equation: Supple < Demand = Collectable.


I respect all of your authority on the discourse and when I first saw people calling you Don, I genuinly thought it was because you were like the head (as in the mafia, the big boss) - You know your cards and I don't particularly want to be embroiled in a debate with you but we both have opposite opinions. You have yours, I have mine - we'll have to wait a few years to find out who is correct. Maybe then I'll regret that I didn't buy more gold seals when I could, maybe I'll be greatful. Who knows? Thank you for your side of things because it clarified that some of my things seemed unfounded - but yeah I hope I answered your points.


Thanks
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Re: NEW DECK - Bicycle Spectrum -- Kickstarter is ACTIVE!
« Reply #192 on: February 27, 2012, 02:48:44 PM »
 

NathanCanadas

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I think it's a great idea. It is fun for both him, collectors, and magician, and doesn't cost anything extra. + it looks nice!
 

Re: NEW DECK - Bicycle Spectrum -- Kickstarter is ACTIVE!
« Reply #193 on: February 27, 2012, 06:30:10 PM »
 

Evan

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Those are some long posts  :P

Cosmo, will the decks be available after Kickstarter too? I don't have money to buy these at the moment.
 

Re: NEW DECK - Bicycle Spectrum -- Kickstarter is ACTIVE!
« Reply #194 on: February 27, 2012, 07:22:35 PM »
 

Cosmo Solano

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yes they will, I plan on having them available for the magic dealers...
 

Re: NEW DECK - Bicycle Spectrum -- Kickstarter is ACTIVE!
« Reply #195 on: February 27, 2012, 07:51:07 PM »
 

hazofhorsham

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Cosmo - how many decks of the Gold Seal were made available on kickstarter? Because you said you sold out the other night buy I only count 1261 sold decks... I am thinking only half of the 2500 run?
Some Men just want to watch the world burn.
 

Re: NEW DECK - Bicycle Spectrum -- Kickstarter is ACTIVE!
« Reply #196 on: February 27, 2012, 10:02:29 PM »
 

NathanCanadas

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Cosmo - how many decks of the Gold Seal were made available on kickstarter? Because you said you sold out the other night buy I only count 1261 sold decks... I am thinking only half of the 2500 run?
I think maybe he is keeping the rest for himself... Although it does seem like a lot!
 

Re: NEW DECK - Bicycle Spectrum -- Kickstarter is ACTIVE!
« Reply #197 on: February 27, 2012, 10:08:21 PM »
 

dmbaggs

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Cosmo - how many decks of the Gold Seal were made available on kickstarter? Because you said you sold out the other night buy I only count 1261 sold decks... I am thinking only half of the 2500 run?
I think maybe he is keeping the rest for himself... Although it does seem like a lot!

I'd be guessing those would go to resellers or something. I doubt he need that many extras haha
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Re: NEW DECK - Bicycle Spectrum -- Kickstarter is ACTIVE!
« Reply #198 on: February 27, 2012, 10:17:15 PM »
 

NathanCanadas

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Cosmo - how many decks of the Gold Seal were made available on kickstarter? Because you said you sold out the other night buy I only count 1261 sold decks... I am thinking only half of the 2500 run?
I think maybe he is keeping the rest for himself... Although it does seem like a lot!
I'd be guessing those would go to resellers or something. I doubt he need that many extras haha

I meant to say he is keeping them for himself to resell them afterwards, once the prices will have increased.
PS: I just reached 4 days spent online on AC!
 

Re: NEW DECK - Bicycle Spectrum -- Kickstarter is ACTIVE!
« Reply #199 on: February 28, 2012, 03:33:24 AM »
 

Don Boyer

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@hazofhorsham: We don't see completely eye to eye on this, but at least you understood what I was getting across and it helped to refine your ideas about this deck and collectible decks in general.  What more could a person ask for?

My "authority" around here is fiction!  Some people appreciate my opinions and respect them, others probably think I'm full of cow dung.  I write a lot so my posts appear in front of more faces and more people make up their minds about who I am.  But I have no more authority around here than you do.  It's a community, not a hierarchy.
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