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Playing Card Chat ♠ ♥ ♣ ♦ => Playing Card Plethora => Topic started by: Rob Wright on February 28, 2015, 09:40:18 PM
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Steelers. #Madisonpresents#Ellusionist
(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/6c/24/ec/6c24ec7c973962357827b59b13496c3d.jpg)
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Didn't we have pictures of this elsewhere? We should combine them.
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I wasn't able to find anything when I originally posted.
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Never seen this one before.
Madison Revolvers were mentioned before, but I don't recall steelers.
Doesn't look like a deck to me... looks like some sort of metal card clip.
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I like to reserve judgement of things until I can see some of the deck. This snake skin looking grating stuff though.... Not feeling it, at all.
I'm at the point where I'd like to see what other element decks E had in mind when they were doing Fathom and Ignite. DM, no offense, may be time to take a breather and enjoy the success for a few months to get the fresh back.
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Didn't we have pictures of this elsewhere? We should combine them.
source: Kete Moon and Ellusionists.
(http://love.youthwant.com.tw/LoveSchool_xfile/M_place/72/100123572//GRAPH/150228095921z10Y.jpg)
(http://igcdn-photos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xfa1/t51.2885-15/10725062_388297864684097_2064184441_n.jpg)
(http://igcdn-photos-e-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xaf1/t51.2885-15/10979650_644954548942564_1792555905_n.jpg)
(http://igcdn-photos-a-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xaf1/t51.2885-15/11005027_408148186029408_679905846_n.jpg)
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xfp1/v/t1.0-9/10998886_719864834794091_1829630418701566886_n.jpg?oh=cfe828f88ec496d358e69c21e93644fc&oe=5588BCF7&__gda__=1435209086_2e5bd27bc349c3514d575e573e725d58)
and I still prefer the name LTD Viper Borderless ;D
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A new deck entered in BC.
Another "Only 5,000 Steel Decks were created".
http://www.ellusionist.com/the-steel-deck.html
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A new deck entered in BC.
Another "Only 5,000 Steel Decks were created".
http://www.ellusionist.com/the-steel-deck.html
Merged your topic with the pre-existing one.
What's BC?
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A new deck entered in BC.
Another "Only 5,000 Steel Decks were created".
http://www.ellusionist.com/the-steel-deck.html
Merged your topic with the pre-existing one.
What's BC?
Short for Black Club :P but very confused with Blue Crown :-\
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A new deck entered in BC.
Another "Only 5,000 Steel Decks were created".
http://www.ellusionist.com/the-steel-deck.html
Merged your topic with the pre-existing one.
What's BC?
Short for Black Club :P but very confused with Blue Crown :-\
That's exactly what I was thinking as well - Blue Crown! But I knew it made no sense. I forgot about Black Club. (I get the feeling I'm not alone in that sentiment...)
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Wow, this is going to cause my first public rant on PCF! Here goes... >:(
I made the mistake of joining black club this year, mainly for the decks but the downloads were cool too.
The membership is $150 and you get a free gift (a artifice black and some bracelet thing), they shipped the free gift and labelled it with a value of $150 which I had to pay customs on the full amount of. That in itself is ridiculous because the $150 was supposedly for the membership.
Now they've released their first deck since I joined (more on that in a moment) I almost guarantee that I'll be paying more customs duty if I choose to take it for 'free' as per the black club member deal. So after paying $150 to get all the decks for free I have paid a massive import duty on a black artifice deck and will end up paying effectively double on any of the 'free' decks I get. They will probably cost more in this way that if I just bought them outright.
To top that off, the first deck released since I joined is this? What the hell is this thing? The chainlink fence deck? Barrels have been scraped.
I'm just going to order up the additional 2 black artifices that I can buy as a BC member and stick them on ebay to try and minimise some of the damage. Lesson learnt!
Update: From what I gather this one isn't included in the 'free' decks for BC members anyway. It's a limited release (of 5000)
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Tom, by all means, rant away. It''s not like there's a lack of reasons for doing so...
Last year, everyone got a bit shafted - lots of promises, not much follow-through. By now I think enough people are turned off that Black Club is just this side of being DOA. The deck giveaways were an interesting idea - but when people stopped to look at what came out over the past year, most just yawned and asked "So what? You're going to send me a bunch of common decks that I probably would have passed on, but the rare ones I'll still have to pay for - if I can even buy them at all?"
Halo? Might have been nice if it was better made. The black covering on the band wears away if you wear it too much. The "collector box" is ridiculous - it holds 15 decks with a HUGE amount of empty space. Gee... The membership card I shoved in my wallet and promptly forgot all about - aside from making two different card reveals, it's as useful as tits on a mule. The rings were hysterical - I bought one, but no jeweler will resize it because it's made of "base metal", so I had to superglue some plastic ring resizers into the back of it - it looks pretty silly from the underside, even after disguising them under a layer of Sharpie ink. The idea itself wasn't so bad, but for the cost, you'd think there'd be a selection of sizes - two sizes do NOT fit all.
If I had all that to deal with AND the BS with paying Customs as you did, I'd be shouting a rant for a refund off the top of the nearest skyscraper. It would fall on deaf ears, of course, but I'd shout anyway.
I get more out of a membership to 52+J than I ever got out of any of these retailer "memberships" by far. I received exactly one reminder about renewing for this year and promptly forgot about it. I think I might have dodged a bullet on that one. Nearly everyone thought they were overpriced to start with. The first year wasn't too bad, but the second was terrible and despite the promises given, this year isn't exactly looking up to snuff so far.
OK, rant over. Back to topic.
Who's sick to death of yet-another in the pantheon of Madison/McKinnon decks? There might actually be more Madison decks now than gods and demigods in the Greek and Roman pantheons combined! Does ANYONE ELSE at Ellusionist make decks? They make decent magic, but as far as playing cards go, it's been a snooze fest for some time now. The back's at least a little interesting, but that's about it. The box is shiny, looks like metal, oooh. (And my spectators don't care.) I don't know what direction they're trying to take these days, but at least the card backs aren't littered with Madison logos everywhere. Standard faces - OK fine, whatever, but for all the excitement they tried to build, I might have expected just a little more than that.
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Magasaki,
I agree with you about the reason why this is not a deck that's being given away for free to BC members (because it's a limited edition deck)... but then again, the Lions Den was also a limited edition deck! Furthermore, it was a Madison Presents deck. Some serious inconsistency from Ellusionist!
Even I get done over when it comes to customs... and so I've recovered the cost pretty much the same way as how you've suggested -- by selling off the freebies and Black Club exclusive decks.
To be honest, that's the only I can think of whereby Black Club membership pays itself off for anybody that is UK based.
This deck itself... in terms of the look, it's probably the furthest that Madison has pushed the boat out, in terms of design. Everything else so far has been very simplistic... and so I guess this is something different. I expect mixed reviews on this one.
I curious to know whether it's a two way back design or a one way... because from the photos, I cannot tell for certain.
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Hi!
This is my first post to the forum! I've been reading through these replies after I looking for more information on the Madison Steelers deck. It seems that BC is very ill recieved here. For that reason I thought it wouldn't be out place to explain how I recoeved part of the BC membership for free. While it was probably a fluke, I don't think it would hurt for someone else to try.
Over holidays I was planning on purchasing the BC and did so, but shortly after, a promotion was offered for the exact price of the club. I canceled my order and was ready to reorder when I realized that I was still a member. I never actually recieved any collector's box, etc, but I still have all the discount, download, and free deck benefits, and I can even access the BC store. Like I said, the chances of it happening again are slim, but I thought I'd give out the idea, in hopes that someone can benefit. I hope the fact that I benefitted doesn't offend anyone who has actually payed, as I can understand the frustration of getting little real benefit for a $150 price tag.
To the topic of the Steelers deck, this is definitely not a performace deck. I'm guessing the best it would do is sit in a collection reflecting light. The reason I bought it was for the "metal" tuck, but to be honest, I don't think that will be such high quality. Knowing E, it will just be a foil tuck, with a bit of metallic pixel shading to give the "smoothed metal" look. If such a deck had been produced by LPCC or EPCC I would have jumped on it with much more enthusiasm. I hope I'll be pleasantly surprised, but I doubt it.
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I did question E about the free deck and this is what i get after customer service send my feedback to "someone". I believe i was not the only one asking as well.
Hey Black Club, we've had a few questions on our social media regarding the whereabouts of your FREE Steel deck.
As a member of our Black Club you're entitled to 1 free deck on every general release. This excludes rare decks.
The STEEL deck is a rare deck and will never be re-printed, and unfortunately doesn't come with Black Club membership.
What do you guys mean by 'rare' deck?
A rare deck is a 10,000 or fewer print-run of cards (usually only 5,000 or 2,500). It takes our characteristic designs and ensures you get the quality and exclusivity that you expect from Ellusionist.
But ... I got Lions Den, and they were rare?
To introduce our Black Club members to the Madison presents line, we decided to give Lions Den cards away for FREE, as a gesture of goodwill for signing up for Black Club and sticking with us for the incredible 2015 we've got planned for you.
We knew we had other decks coming up, and we didn't want to keep you waiting....
Coming soon, we've got some incredible releases for you, and you'll be the first to know. We apologize for any confusion on this, and we hope for those that managed to pick-up a brick of the new steel deck, that you'll enjoy them as much we do.
Your next FREE deck
Okay, so we didn't want to spoil this, but our 3rd deck in the Madison presents series is probably our favourite so far. It smashes the rules on deck design and puts the rumours to bed. They should be in your hands in 2 weeks or less.
Somewhere in this email is a clue to the name of the next deck (as well as the image). We're so pumped about these, and we can't wait for you to get your hands on them.
The membership is $150 and you get a free gift (a artifice black and some bracelet thing), they shipped the free gift and labelled it with a value of $150 which I had to pay customs on the full amount of. That in itself is ridiculous because the $150 was supposedly for the membership.
Now they've released their first deck since I joined (more on that in a moment) I almost guarantee that I'll be paying more customs duty if I choose to take it for 'free' as per the black club member deal. So after paying $150 to get all the decks for free I have paid a massive import duty on a black artifice deck and will end up paying effectively double on any of the 'free' decks I get. They will probably cost more in this way that if I just bought them outright.
Like what you said, the $150 is for the membership and the rest are free gifts along with it. Have you wrote to E about this issue? Not that i actually think they would refund you, but perhaps they could do something to make it up to you in other ways.
To the topic of the Steelers deck, this is definitely not a performace deck. I'm guessing the best it would do is sit in a collection reflecting light. The reason I bought it was for the "metal" tuck, but to be honest, I don't think that will be such high quality. Knowing E, it will just be a foil tuck, with a bit of metallic pixel shading to give the "smoothed metal" look. If such a deck had been produced by LPCC or EPCC I would have jumped on it with much more enthusiasm. I hope I'll be pleasantly surprised, but I doubt it.
I have no idea what are you expecting out of the tuck of this deck, even if it were to be produced by LPCC or EPCC? I certainly hope you are not expecting a metal tuck case. I also do not know why would you buy it for the "metal" tuck, if you are expecting the "metal" tuck to be disappointing.
I am sure design wise, it is a disappointing deck to most of us who have been collecting for some time and have seen the great works of other designers. I also agree it is about time Madison took a breather instead of probably trying to hit a quota on the number of decks to be produced. But then again, metal (or textured decks) are very popular among newbies and the layman who knows nothing about cards. Metal rider backs by Max sold well for me, many to collectors, but twice as many to people who probably owns this as their first deck getting it only because of the texturized look. In no way am i comparing the designs of these 2 decks, but i have a feeling a lot of people will be interested in these.
Like what Don always say, we are, but only a small part of the card community.
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Hey Black Club, we've had a few questions on our social media regarding the whereabouts of your FREE Steel deck.
As a member of our Black Club you're entitled to 1 free deck on every general release. This excludes rare decks.
The STEEL deck is a rare deck and will never be re-printed, and unfortunately doesn't come with Black Club membership.
This only reconfirms my decision NOT to renew Black Club. I'm sorry some of you had to find out this way. The value is in the rare decks. If it were 1 unlimited deck a month (12), I still would have trouble finding the value at the $147 club price point. Calling it a free deck when your really over paying per deck is ridiculous.
Personally, I think this deck would have looked and sold better with a border.
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I was so tempted by the BC membership late last year, especially with the discount price of $124.
All the advertising is so promising and sounds too good to be true. Luckily I didn't fall for it, since I did a little research on the web and quite a lot of people rant about BC membership.
And I am also a little disappointed with the cards that E released in the past year, including this one.
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PurpleIce's letter from E is very disappointing on a number of levels.
1) If they know a deck design is going to be really popular, they simply have to make it rare to save themselves the expense of shipping it to Black Club members. They don't even have to make a big stink about it and make it a premium-only deck - they just have to say "We made less than 10,000 and won't make more." Not a difficult hurdle to leap over.
2) It's true that if they came out with a new, commonly-available deck every month, you're getting about half what your membership is worth, plus the shipping. Problem is, most of their decks are so much like all the others - or just plain not good (cough-EXECUTIVE-cough) - that it's not worth shelling out for it.
3) We just learned that there's YET ANOTHER MADISON DECK COMING!! Will they not be happy until the forests are turned to deserts and piles of Madison decks cover the landscape, so large they can be seen from space? Do they work with ANYONE ELSE to make their decks?
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I have no idea what are you expecting out of the tuck of this deck, even if it were to be produced by LPCC or EPCC? I certainly hope you are not expecting a metal tuck case. I also do not know why would you buy it for the "metal" tuck, if you are expecting the "metal" tuck to be disappointing.
I hope I didn't offend you in any way. No, I of course wasn't expecting a metal tuck, lol. I was hoping to tell what I believed the tuck was going to look like, and also mention that I believe EPCC could have also made an interesting version of this, maybe making it a steel "pearlescent" style tuck (just an idea). Also, I didn't think the tuck or the deck was disappointing. Though it isn't anything special, I did think it would make an interesting deck. Of course, there is much more to a deck than the case. I guess my wording didn't make this very clear.
Also, another Madison deck? Why?...
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Also, another Madison deck? Why?...
I understand Madison's decks have most likely out sold any deck E has produced before. However... as a brand, is it a good business decision to put most if not all your eggs (playing card projects) in Madison's Basket? Especially given the fact that his decks have lost their appeal with many. Who's the real success of his decks, is it Madison or USPCC who still have a strong customer following that continues to buy (new or old) almost everything they manufacture?
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Also, another Madison deck? Why?...
I understand Madison's decks have most likely out sold any deck E has produced before. However... as a brand, is it a good business decision to put most if not all your eggs (playing card projects) in Madison's Basket? Especially given the fact that his decks have lost their appeal with many. Who's the real success of his decks, is it Madison or USPCC who still have a strong customer following that continues to buy (new or old) almost everything they manufacture?
What is interesting is that there are many (check the Ellusionist facebook page) that consistently commend these new Madison decks. While I personally buy some of the decks for the fact that they are custom decks, I don't think they are as groundbreaking as many make them out to be. I agree that the business decision is questionable. They have been risking a lot with collectors, but I don't know what the rest of their following looks like.
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Ill put my 2cents on this...
We are not the market targeted by the Madison decks.... Thats why we think "pppfff Another Madison deck"
But in reality the market for this deck its the younger magicians who dig Madison's persona and will buy whatever he throws at them.
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I had my respect to Madison when I started card magic, especially angle z and advocate..
In the beginning I bought Madison player, then 1 of the dealers. After that I have to stop because it is crazy to buy every decks that he created, that put me off so bad I stop buying his cards.
Even for the Kings I hesitate when purchasing it, in fact now I regret it.
He needs to slow down :o
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PurpleIce's letter from E is very disappointing on a number of levels.
3) We just learned that there's YET ANOTHER MADISON DECK COMING!! Will they not be happy until the forests are turned to deserts and piles of Madison decks cover the landscape, so large they can be seen from space? Do they work with ANYONE ELSE to make their decks?
This is the most disappointing one actually...LOL
To give my personal opinion on BC. I am getting it for the BC-members only deck. I sell them and make a profit and i recover whatever i spend on BC. Not a fool-proof way, but so far i am getting by it. The additional BC discount for decks that i sell also helps out in a certain way. And while i make no use of it. I am sure magicians-to-be will be pleased with the free downloads they can get as well.
If you are considering joining BC just for their free decks, then quite frankly it is no where near worth the cost of the membership. My advice is don't join just for the sake of being a member of the BC. Only join if you think it is worth it. I strongly believe E has no shortage of members and certainly will not make it so much better just because one of us decides not to join.
I have no idea what are you expecting out of the tuck of this deck, even if it were to be produced by LPCC or EPCC? I certainly hope you are not expecting a metal tuck case. I also do not know why would you buy it for the "metal" tuck, if you are expecting the "metal" tuck to be disappointing.
I hope I didn't offend you in any way. No, I of course wasn't expecting a metal tuck, lol. I was hoping to tell what I believed the tuck was going to look like, and also mention that I believe EPCC could have also made an interesting version of this, maybe making it a steel "pearlescent" style tuck (just an idea). Also, I didn't think the tuck or the deck was disappointing. Though it isn't anything special, I did think it would make an interesting deck. Of course, there is much more to a deck than the case. I guess my wording didn't make this very clear.
Also, another Madison deck? Why?...
Hi Sterph,
Just like to make a mention. No, you did not offend me in anyway. We are all entitled to our own opinions, and i'm sorry if it may seem that i come off hard. (btw, a few buyers are already asking me if the cards are made of metal. So...you can never predict what people think)
I'm just wondering what you were expecting, as i do not believe either EPCC or LPCC would go for anything high end for that kind of price point for the tuck, similar to the case of steelers now. I believe all 3 companies are capable of doing a better job, just not for what i would consider a normal deck (despite E claiming it is limited or rare).
So, no ill intentions in anyway. Cheers.
Ill put my 2cents on this...
We are not the market targeted by the Madison decks.... Thats why we think "pppfff Another Madison deck"
But in reality the market for this deck its the younger magicians who dig Madison's persona and will buy whatever he throws at them.
This, i personally agree. I am very sure we are just a very small group to E. There are many magicians wannabe, younger magicians or just the general public out there that probably love Madison and can't wait to see another Madison deck.
It is only right for E to go for what they think is most profitable to them.
Either that or E can't find any better designers, and wants Madison to earn his keep. :P
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Hi Sterph,
Just like to make a mention. No, you did not offend me in anyway. We are all entitled to our own opinions, and i'm sorry if it may seem that i come off hard. (btw, a few buyers are already asking me if the cards are made of metal. So...you can never predict what people think)
I'm just wondering what you were expecting, as i do not believe either EPCC or LPCC would go for anything high end for that kind of price point for the tuck, similar to the case of steelers now. I believe all 3 companies are capable of doing a better job, just not for what i would consider a normal deck (despite E claiming it is limited or rare).
So, no ill intentions in anyway. Cheers.
No worries :) I apologize as I also may have come off a bit hard.
Thanks for the discussion though, as I now do agree that the other two may not neccessarily have done much better. Honestly, I believe that the Steeler concept and design could have been much better, and I am disappointed, although I did purchase it simply because it rare deck (maybe I'll be able to sell it later).
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I picked up some more Black Club exclusive decks to sell off (in order to recover the cost of my black club membership), and so I decided to get one of these also, just to test out (seeing as they are priced pretty low).
The good things:
- I like the tuck. It really does go great with the theme, and the paper has got something of a sanded feel to it. Pretty cool, I think.
- The courts are really simple, recoloured traditional courts... but I think it works.
- The overall theme of the deck is something I like. It's not executed as well as the Bicycle Metal deck, but still, good theme.
The bad things:
- It's a one way back design. Not cool.
- I thought USPCC's cutting had improved (the Lions Den cards had edges that were much better than previous USPCc decks)... but the cutting on this is dreadful. Really "furry". Quality appears to have nosedived.
- Not traditionally cut... and so shuffling wasn't as easy, and as a result of the full bleed design, the edges started showing visible signs of wear after around 8 shuffles. Again, not cool.
- This deck appears to use that horrible magic finish... and so the first card trick I managed with this deck was 52 card pick up.
Overall, I'm not impressed. I think the Lions Den was better than this deck.
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- This deck appears to use that horrible magic finish... and so the first card trick I managed with this deck was 52 card pick up.
Hahaha, I'm very well practiced in this magic trick as well. Incidentally from the same situation as you found yourself in here. I thought it might possibly be just me, so this really makes me feel better. Have a new deck someone wants to see it, so I show it to them. They request a trick a few times which turns into shuffle shuffle shuffle dribble shuffle shuffle and ultimately giving in to making an attempt. Then the explosion of magic happens and they're everywhere. Next minute is spent picking up the deck and the minute following looking for that straggler that always manages to end up twenty feet away.
I didn't much care for the card backs on the steel deck either. Just not a very inventive deck at all. I'm sure some people think it's the greatest thing since The Lions Den though, that's great for them. This one just wasn't my style.
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Lol. You've probably done better than me Fes, because you at least get a few shuffles and dribbles in... but for me, I don't even get that done before the self-working 52 card pickup trick happens!
I nearly always start by interlacing the cards, and then doing that faro-bridge shuffle that Steve Forte does... but with magic finish cards, one of two things happen:
(1) Either they cards fly off the table when I'm trying to interlace the two halves, or
(2) When I arch the cards to bridge them into each other, they proceed to fly off the table.
Therefore, not a single shuffle gets completed for me!
On a serious note though, I took it for granted that Madison would just go with USPCC's standard coating rather than that magic finish coating -- after all, I can't think of any serious cardmen (as in gambling demo people) that use magic finish on any of their signature decks.
Madison's next deck appears to have some sort of connection with illuminati symbols... and design wise, Ellusionist seem to be excited about it. For handling, I have no expectations -- it'll be unusable for me. Therefore, if I do get any, it'll just be with a view to selling them on later so that I can buy some Legends or Expert cards. Lol.
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Lol. You've probably done better than me Fes, because you at least get a few shuffles and dribbles in... but for me, I don't even get that done before the self-working 52 card pickup trick happens!
I nearly always start by interlacing the cards, and then doing that faro-bridge shuffle that Steve Forte does... but with magic finish cards, one of two things happen:
(1) Either they cards fly off the table when I'm trying to interlace the two halves, or
(2) When I arch the cards to bridge them into each other, they proceed to fly off the table.
Therefore, not a single shuffle gets completed for me!
On a serious note though, I took it for granted that Madison would just go with USPCC's standard coating rather than that magic finish coating -- after all, I can't think of any serious cardmen (as in gambling demo people) that use magic finish on any of their signature decks.
Madison's next deck appears to have some sort of connection with illuminati symbols... and design wise, Ellusionist seem to be excited about it. For handling, I have no expectations -- it'll be unusable for me. Therefore, if I do get any, it'll just be with a view to selling them on later so that I can buy some Legends or Expert cards. Lol.
USPC uses Magic Finish as the default finish for all their custom decks. Ellusionist practically swears by it - they helped test the finish, producing the first Magic Finish deck, the Gold Arcane. E uses the original code name that the coating had, "Performance Coating," and applies it on all of their decks now.
I've had the "52 pick-up experience" once or twice myself - but with BOTH the standard and Magic Finish coatings. Technically, Magic Finish, despite the name, isn't a finish; it's a coating, one that can be applied on a smooth or embossed card.
E is ALWAYS excited about Madison's next deck. And the one after that, and the one after that, ad nauseum. They've made all but his very first deck, which was a T11 deck.
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I haven't said it yet, but I've thought it often enough so I guess I'll add voice. This deck reminds me a lot of one of the lesser CPC decks.
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We just learned that there's YET ANOTHER MADISON DECK COMING!! Will they not be happy until the forests are turned to deserts and piles of Madison decks cover the landscape, so large they can be seen from space? Do they work with ANYONE ELSE to make their decks?
Will be 12 to 20 decks this year from E. Landscape, portrait, square, etc, you name it. Wallets down, no gifts, no Christmas, no Easter, just...E! After 2 or 3 years of Black Club membership I close my wallet. What can I say? Me happy! I bought a Suunto Ambit 3 and a bike and now I am running like Forrest Gump and cycling :D
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I haven't said it yet, but I've thought it often enough so I guess I'll add voice. This deck reminds me a lot of one of the lesser CPC decks.
Very interesting comparison, and unfortunately very apt. It feels like they haven't made a great deck since Artifice and the original LTD design, pre-Madisonized.