Author (Read 16035 times)

Evan · « **on:** April 05, 2012, 05:13:48 PM »

A Facebook page that sells decks in Asia posted these for sale but I've never heard or/seen them.
The flap looks like it says Bicycle.

CBJ · « **Reply #1 on:** April 05, 2012, 05:30:55 PM »

They are printed at USPCC, and have custom court cards.

You can buy them from

www.facebook.com/asiamagicshop

1 deck is approx $6.50 USD
and they have a special right now..

"SPECIAL PROMOTION : Buy 12 decks of Pandora (colour can be mixed) for only RM220. Offer ends as soon as our stock arrives. Thank you." = approx $72 USD
CBJ

Evan · « **Reply #2 on:** April 05, 2012, 05:34:33 PM »

For a custom deck, thats a good price. And the brick promotion is definitely a plus.
I just want to find a place in the U.S. that sells them so that shipping will be cheaper.

CBJ · « **Reply #3 on:** April 05, 2012, 05:37:43 PM »

Well, they told me custom court cards.. but I just came across this..

http://www.zazzle.ca/pandora_vine_backs_poster-228995875458368705

So, I don't know what to think

CBJ

Evan · « **Reply #4 on:** April 05, 2012, 05:41:21 PM »

Quote from: CBJ on April 05, 2012, 05:37:43 PM

Well, they told me custom court cards.. but I just came across this..

http://www.zazzle.ca/pandora_vine_backs_poster-228995875458368705

So, I don't know what to think

CBJ

The picture in that link does show custom court cards and they look alright from what I can see.

sinsandman · « **Reply #5 on:** April 05, 2012, 08:45:07 PM »

Look closer my friend. The courts are indeed custom to an extent. Coloration, facial expressions

NathanCanadas · « **Reply #6 on:** April 05, 2012, 08:47:24 PM »

Quote from: sinsandman on April 05, 2012, 08:45:07 PM

Look closer my friend. The courts are indeed custom to an extent. Coloration, facial expressions

Nice catch, but that's barely custom, it's almost only recolored.

Evan · « **Reply #7 on:** April 05, 2012, 09:03:55 PM »

Quote from: NathanCanadas on April 05, 2012, 08:47:24 PM

Quote from: sinsandman on April 05, 2012, 08:45:07 PM
Look closer my friend. The courts are indeed custom to an extent. Coloration, facial expressions
Nice catch, but that's barely custom, it's almost only recolored.

Theres no "barely custom"
Custom court cards are custom court cards....

DelMagic · « **Reply #8 on:** April 05, 2012, 10:33:59 PM »

So, do you have to be a Facebook user in order to buy their products? I am not on Facebook and when I follow the link in this thread I can see some info, but I don't see how to purchase the decks.

jmrock · « **Reply #9 on:** April 05, 2012, 10:43:46 PM »

Does anyone else feel that everything is just starting to look the effing same??? Pandora, Pirate, Vision, Cage Gardens, etc... I'd love to pick up everything I see, but I've got to tell you it's all starting to blend together...

(I will tell you, I folded and picked up a Mana & I happen to like it... It's a good looking deck...)

RandyButterfield · « **Reply #10 on:** April 05, 2012, 11:17:51 PM »

Quote from: jmrock on April 05, 2012, 10:43:46 PM

Does anyone else feel that everything is just starting to look the effing same??? Pandora, Pirate, Vision, Cage Gardens, etc... I'd love to pick up everything I see, but I've got to tell you it's all starting to blend together...

Yeh, I'm not sure why a lot of new decks have 1-Color Black backs. It's almost like the designers are afraid to use color!

I'm guessing some designers think that the cost difference of printing a 1-Color back is more desirable over a higher-priced 4-Color Process back. Personally, I would choose rich and vivid 4-Color back designs (Vaudeville, Americana, Vortex, Tendril, Ornate!) over a 1-Color back anyday.

thanks, Randy

K · « **Reply #11 on:** April 06, 2012, 12:31:57 AM »

Quote from: DelMagic on April 05, 2012, 10:33:59 PM

So, do you have to be a Facebook user in order to buy their products? I am not on Facebook and when I follow the link in this thread I can see some info, but I don't see how to purchase the decks.

yes you've to create and facebook account and friend them in order to see what they're selling

saurabh · « **Reply #12 on:** April 06, 2012, 01:06:48 AM »

Quote from: DelMagic on April 05, 2012, 10:33:59 PM

So, do you have to be a Facebook user in order to buy their products? I am not on Facebook and when I follow the link in this thread I can see some info, but I don't see how to purchase the decks.

They sell through email also. They do not have a catalogue as such, but if you know what you're looking for, try emailing them at asiamagicshopfb@yahoo.com

wiepie · « **Reply #13 on:** April 06, 2012, 06:47:35 AM »

Latest post from Facebook of Asia Magic :
Due to overwhelming response by our customers, we now have a custom wholesale deal open for EVERYONE. Paying only RM2640, you are getting yourself a package worth RM4000!!! We have very limited supply for this deal so act fast!
you'll get 72 black deck + 72 White Deck + 10 Ultragaff + 2 Ultragaff signed by WH & DG

LauR · « **Reply #14 on:** April 06, 2012, 09:57:54 AM »

Is this a limited run?

hondo88 · « **Reply #15 on:** April 06, 2012, 03:11:23 PM »

http://www.magictrickstore.com/pandora-deck-white-magic-tricks-p-36327.html

Both the black and white decks are availabe at the above site for $4.40 each til Tuesday April 10th.

sinsandman · « **Reply #16 on:** April 06, 2012, 11:44:12 PM »

Nice find Hondo...you just saved me a bunch of money by switching to Geico..........

KT · « **Reply #17 on:** April 07, 2012, 12:06:26 AM »

The designs are nice but it doesn't really attract me like what the other
decks did (Mana, Seasons, Vortex)

Dudeee · « **Reply #18 on:** April 07, 2012, 04:37:58 AM »

Can someone tell us more about the stock and finish?

Perhaps a review?

Don Boyer · « **Reply #19 on:** April 07, 2012, 05:18:04 AM »

Quote from: Dudeee on April 07, 2012, 04:37:58 AM

Can someone tell us more about the stock and finish?

Perhaps a review?

Yeah, I can just pull facts out of my butt... Dudeee - dude! The deck JUST came out, and from a source that's relatively unknown. We know as much about it as you do right now, or someone would have said as much.

If these were really costly, I'd say pass, but hell, you can get them for barely more than standard Bikes. I'd be at least curious enough to check them out.

I dig what some people were saying about the one-color back as opposed to some of the newer four-color designs, but you have to admit that until VERY recently, nearly all non-bridge playing cards were one-color backs. especially the more classic designs. There's a certain elegance to it, when done right.

sinsandman · « **Reply #20 on:** April 07, 2012, 08:29:35 AM »

I picked some up. I'll do a written review for you guys.

cosmicsecret · « **Reply #21 on:** April 07, 2012, 10:42:23 AM »

my fav. magicshop in germany got them in stock as well for 5.90€ a deck.
i doubt that those are limited to 5000.
personally i like the design because its a elegant looking deck.
the color combo is good looking to me and the gaff card which is incl. is very usefull! (speaking of the queens)
i will pick up 2 of each deck

ReaganM · « **Reply #22 on:** April 07, 2012, 08:39:44 PM »

Those look really fantastic and I dont think 6.50 is a bad price at all.

Don Boyer · « **Reply #23 on:** April 08, 2012, 12:01:30 AM »

Quote from: ReaganM on April 07, 2012, 08:39:44 PM

Those look really fantastic and I dont think 6.50 is a bad price at all.

Um, you did notice the post where you could buy them for a mere $4.40 a pack, right?

chisairi · « **Reply #24 on:** April 08, 2012, 01:29:08 AM »

which company design this deck ?

Dudeee · « **Reply #25 on:** April 08, 2012, 03:42:13 AM »

Quote from: Don Boyer on April 07, 2012, 05:18:04 AM

Quote from: Dudeee on April 07, 2012, 04:37:58 AM
Can someone tell us more about the stock and finish?

Perhaps a review?

Yeah, I can just pull facts out of my butt... Dudeee - dude! The deck JUST came out, and from a source that's relatively unknown. We know as much about it as you do right now, or someone would have said as much.

If these were really costly, I'd say pass, but hell, you can get them for barely more than standard Bikes. I'd be at least curious enough to check them out.

I dig what some people were saying about the one-color back as opposed to some of the newer four-color designs, but you have to admit that until VERY recently, nearly all non-bridge playing cards were one-color backs. especially the more classic designs. There's a certain elegance to it, when done right.

I agree, that's why I already ordered a mixed brick. I just hoped the creators of the decks see this post and tells us a little more about the cards.

Don Boyer · « **Reply #26 on:** April 08, 2012, 04:33:11 AM »

Quote from: Dudeee on April 08, 2012, 03:42:13 AM

I agree, that's why I already ordered a mixed brick. I just hoped the creators of the decks see this post and tells us a little more about the cards.

Instead of praying to the goddess of chance, why not make it happen? Approach one of the sellers and ask for more information. I really doubt the artist is hiding behind a screen of anonymity. Unless it's the-con-artist.com, of course!

xZEROx · « **Reply #27 on:** April 08, 2012, 10:29:42 AM »

I've got a question though. If "Bicycle" is printed at the flap, why would it not be printed on the tuck box? Does it not seem odd?

sinsandman · « **Reply #28 on:** April 08, 2012, 02:24:52 PM »

Many decks are trying to do their own thing now. Maybe it is like a partial thing. Correct me if I am wrong here, but it is cheaper if the Bicycle brand is on it right? So maybe they struck a deal where the logo is the flap for a little bi of a price cut?? Speculation

moonexe · « **Reply #29 on:** April 08, 2012, 04:49:04 PM »

Quote from: sinsandman on April 08, 2012, 02:24:52 PM

Correct me if I am wrong here, but it is cheaper if the Bicycle brand is on it right?

Nope, it's actually the opposite; you pay for the rights to use the Bicycle brand, precisely 61 cents more per deck as of February; although the increase does includes magic finish in the base price, which would be 20 cents per deck otherwise.

Aaron · « **Reply #30 on:** April 08, 2012, 04:52:01 PM »

Quote from: Moon.exe on April 08, 2012, 04:49:04 PM

Quote from: sinsandman on April 08, 2012, 02:24:52 PM
Correct me if I am wrong here, but it is cheaper if the Bicycle brand is on it right?
Nope, it's actually the opposite; you pay for the rights to use the Bicycle brand, precisely 61 cents more per deck as of February; although the increase does includes magic finish in the base price, which would be 20 cents per deck otherwise.

Are you sure? I also thought bicycle branded was cheaper, it would only make sense because it is advertising fr bicycle. With the Galvanic deck Kickstarter if enough money was raised the bicycle brand was taken off.

SeanWhelan · « **Reply #31 on:** April 08, 2012, 05:12:27 PM »

Yup to have the Bicycle brand is cheaper then taking the name off the box. I can't give how much it cost to take the brand name off but its a huge difference in price. The reason being is if Bicycle" is taking off there is a chance less people will buy the deck. So they charge more upfront.

sinsandman · « **Reply #32 on:** April 08, 2012, 05:19:51 PM »

Thanks for clearing that up. It only makes sense that it would be cheaper. So the fact that is on the flap and not in your face on the front may be a bit cheaper than just not having the branding anywhere.

SeanWhelan · « **Reply #33 on:** April 08, 2012, 05:21:49 PM »

Actually to me that doesn't make sense and was shocked when I was quoted for the Galvanic deck. You would think you need to pay more to sport the Bicycle logo. Weird

moonexe · « **Reply #34 on:** April 08, 2012, 05:30:48 PM »

I'm not sure where you guys get your info, but here's the official price sheet from USPC... I circled relevant stuff for convenience. Might have been different in the past though.

SeanWhelan · « **Reply #35 on:** April 09, 2012, 12:41:15 AM »

Got my pricing directly from uspcc themselves while in talk with the Galvanic deck

KT · « **Reply #36 on:** April 09, 2012, 05:37:54 AM »

Got these decks in my hands already = D

Don Boyer · « **Reply #37 on:** April 09, 2012, 06:34:12 AM »

Quote from: KT on April 09, 2012, 05:37:54 AM

Got these decks in my hands already = D

And you're waiting to tell us about them because...?

Bust out the camera and get some photos up already!

KT · « **Reply #38 on:** April 09, 2012, 07:41:42 AM »

Okay so here are the photos of the deck

Here is the tuck box

Front:

Back:

Jokers of the White Pandora Deck

Court Cards

White Pandora Deck Gaff Cards

Comparison of Ace of Spades of both Black and White Deck

Comparison of Jokers of both decks
You would see that the Joker of the Black deck has darker ink on the joker. Sorry if you are unable to see it through the photo

Gaff cards of the Black Pandora

The Court cards and Aces ( Other than Ace of Spades) of both the decks are the same .

When I got it, it was poorly wrapped and the cards were already kind of sticking ( Don't know if I'm the only one facing this problem ) and it kind of affected the handling of the cards.

As for the designs and stuff, "Beauty is in the eye of the beholder". I'll leave it for you to decide = D

KT · « **Reply #39 on:** April 09, 2012, 07:46:32 AM »

I apologise for the gigantic photos.

Don Boyer · « **Reply #40 on:** April 09, 2012, 09:07:12 AM »

Quote from: KT on April 09, 2012, 07:46:32 AM

I apologise for the gigantic photos.

Never apologize for showing us a deck, especially a cool one like this. I don't care if I need a bigger monitor!

Now I want this deck! And I'm short on CASH!! But I'm going to place an order at that site selling them at discount until tomorrow.

Wilko · « **Reply #41 on:** April 09, 2012, 09:49:50 AM »

Don I went to the site selling them for $4.40 yesterday and it said they were sold out. I'm still trying to find somewhere else to get these.

sinsandman · « **Reply #42 on:** April 09, 2012, 10:11:36 AM »

KT, where are you located to have them in hand? That is great.

Jin Jian · « **Reply #43 on:** April 09, 2012, 10:33:27 AM »

my local shop is selling them for $8 per decks ..

NathanCanadas · « **Reply #44 on:** April 09, 2012, 10:41:41 AM »

Wow KT thx for the photos! I wasn't able to see the second gaff card from the white pandora. Is it kinda like a lefty card?

Don Boyer · « **Reply #45 on:** April 09, 2012, 04:55:21 PM »

Quote from: NathanCanadas on April 09, 2012, 10:41:41 AM

Wow KT thx for the photos! I wasn't able to see the second gaff card from the white pandora. Is it kinda like a lefty card?

The two cards together are used in two-card and three-card monte routines. Lefty cards have indices on the right upper corners for easier use by a lefty - these don't have that.

Quote from: Wilko on April 09, 2012, 09:49:50 AM

Don I went to the site selling them for $4.40 yesterday and it said they were sold out. I'm still trying to find somewhere else to get these.

I guess it's a blessing in disguise. I'm a little tight for cash now, anyway.

sinsandman · « **Reply #46 on:** April 09, 2012, 09:10:04 PM »

A limited deck going for $5 per deck (rounded up) being sold out is hard to find the silver lining. I'm sure you will find some, Don

Don Boyer · « **Reply #47 on:** April 10, 2012, 01:36:24 AM »

Quote from: sinsandman on April 09, 2012, 09:10:04 PM

A limited deck going for $5 per deck (rounded up) being sold out is hard to find the silver lining. I'm sure you will find some, Don

Aye, but there's the rub - it's not really selling for $5 anymore, is it?

I have to limit my purchases not simply for financial reasons, though they are big ones. Recently, I've been noticing that the collection's gotten so big, I don't get to enjoy the decks as much as I once did. For me, the enjoyment comes not merely in the possession of the cards and having them displayed on a shelf somewhere, but in cracking open a pack and actually using them. I have enough cards now that if I used just one different deck design a day, I wouldn't go through them all in a single year. If I used a single deck to the point of destruction once a day, I'd have enough to last roughly three years, assuming I stopped buying decks right now. I'm even thinking of selling off portions of my collection.

My biggest excuse for getting into cards like this in the first place was that the decks were cool and that I'd use them in a magic act as well as at a poker table. Well, I haven't played a single hand of poker on felt since I started a little over a year ago, and I've shifted to using only common or plastic decks for magic because too many of my nice decks get ruined in a single session. I did one trick, just one trick, for a kid using a pack of USPC Guardians I'd only opened a few days prior. After the trick was done, the edges of the cards were filthy - the kid's hands were a lot dirtier than they looked, apparently. I lost a deck of Tally Ho cards to a kid in a hospital wolfing down fried chicken his parents brought him and neglecting to clean his hands before touching the cards. The list just grows from there...

Anyway, I'm ranting and way off topic. I'd love to get a pair of each color, cheap, but I'd also love to have a nice wedding and honeymoon in south Florida on my birthday later this year. It makes it a lot tougher to forget my anniversary that way...

sinsandman · « **Reply #48 on:** April 10, 2012, 05:56:38 PM »

This deck was not all that well known and has sold out with the quickness. Now, the only places selling them are going $20 and up...this can get interesting.

Don Boyer · « **Reply #49 on:** April 10, 2012, 07:49:15 PM »

Quote from: sinsandman on April 10, 2012, 05:56:38 PM

This deck was not all that well known and has sold out with the quickness. Now, the only places selling them are going $20 and up...this can get interesting.

Quote from: Wilko on April 09, 2012, 09:49:50 AM

Don I went to the site selling them for $4.40 yesterday and it said they were sold out. I'm still trying to find somewhere else to get these.

Magictrickshop.com has them, but the "$4.40 'til 4/10" deal is out the window! $19.95 a pack! What a rip-off!

munro159 · « **Reply #50 on:** April 10, 2012, 09:39:34 PM »

A friend of mine does alot of work in Malaysia, Indonesia, and Singapore. He is in Malaysia right now and is suppose to be checking on picking some of these up for me. We will see!

Don Boyer · « **Reply #51 on:** April 10, 2012, 11:30:55 PM »

Quote from: munro159 on April 10, 2012, 09:39:34 PM

A friend of mine does alot of work in Malaysia, Indonesia, and Singapore. He is in Malaysia right now and is suppose to be checking on picking some of these up for me. We will see!

As we talking "personal stash" or "tradding fodder"?

munro159 · « **Reply #52 on:** April 10, 2012, 11:38:47 PM »

I don't know yet....I don't know the price or how many he can get. I should know by sometime next week. If I can get extras I will definitely be willing to trade!

jmrock · « **Reply #53 on:** April 11, 2012, 12:24:33 AM »

Quote from: Don Boyer on April 10, 2012, 01:36:24 AM

Recently, I've been noticing that the collection's gotten so big, I don't get to enjoy the decks as much as I once did. I'm even thinking of selling off portions of my collection.

I know what you mean Don... I take joy in the Vintage Decks more than ever... There's just so many new and mediocre decks to collect if you want to tout a complete and thorough modern collection... Although I say I don't want or need every deck anymore, the compulsion to want to own every deck takes over and one click here and one click there and just look at how paypal dominates my statements every month... I don't even want to think about it... I have said it has come to a head and I caved and picked up the Mana Deck... But I have to tell you when I cracked open that New Era Deck, I fell in love all over again... and yes, I did pick up a set of the Pandora decks, but now the Triangle Deck, The Liu Chen Deck, Magic Con 2, etc..... It never ever ends...

Don Boyer · « **Reply #54 on:** April 11, 2012, 12:51:57 AM »

Quote from: jmrock on April 11, 2012, 12:24:33 AM

Quote from: Don Boyer on April 10, 2012, 01:36:24 AM
Recently, I've been noticing that the collection's gotten so big, I don't get to enjoy the decks as much as I once did. I'm even thinking of selling off portions of my collection.

I know what you mean Don... I take joy in the Vintage Decks more than ever... There's just so many new and mediocre decks to collect if you want to tout a complete and thorough modern collection... Although I say I don't want or need every deck anymore, the compulsion to want to own every deck takes over and one click here and one click there and just look at how paypal dominates my statements every month... I don't even want to think about it... I have said it has come to a head and I caved and picked up the Mana Deck... But I have to tell you when I cracked open that New Era Deck, I fell in love all over again... and yes, I did pick up a set of the Pandora decks, but now the Triangle Deck, The Liu Chen Deck, Magic Con 2, etc..... It never ever ends...

My personal assessment:

Pandora Vine Backs - a nice deck, but not a MUST-have, certainly not at $20 a pack.
Triangle Deck - doesn't strike me as desirable.
Lu Chen's Spar Deck - artwork rights disputed by artist Si Scott, probably not printed by USPC as a result. Nice, but probably a pass.
Magic Con 2 - take it or leave it, won't blow the wad trying to buy it. The original wasn't really that awesome based on the reviews I read - the major selling point was "It's a Dan and Dave deck!" and I'm just not that fanboy. I'd feel different if I was actually at the Con, but since I'm not...

CBJ · « **Reply #55 on:** April 11, 2012, 10:31:44 AM »

You can still get the Pandora decks for 6USD/deck here

http://www.smproductionz.com/index.php/new-arrivals.html

but.. crazy shipping prices

CBJ

Don Boyer · « **Reply #56 on:** April 11, 2012, 11:00:26 AM »

Quote from: CBJ on April 11, 2012, 10:31:44 AM

You can still get the Pandora decks for 6USD/deck here

http://www.smproductionz.com/index.php/new-arrivals.html

but.. crazy shipping prices

CBJ

Those aren't just crazy shipping prices, they're insane! 4 decks of playing cards worth $24, and $36.50 to ship them with a ten-day arrival time!?!? Lemme guess - that's how much it costs to feed the tortoise as he travels to my PO box with the package strapped to its back?

I emailed them in hopes that it's a glitch. More likely, though, it's a Hong Kong-based shop. The site's in English, but the "About Us" page states "We provide only the top quality one of a kind product from the East. We'll try our very best for your satisfaction." The staff is all-Asian and is fluent in English, Mandarin, Cantonese and Japanese, and most of their own tricks are by Will Tsai.

Gareth · « **Reply #57 on:** April 11, 2012, 11:18:47 AM »

Yep, it appears to be just over $9 per deck in shipping - irrespective of how many your have (I only tried up to 8 decks... $72 in postage...).

So there's a choice I guess, $20 each at magictrickstore, or about $15.xx each posted slowly here

Or... skip them entirely... Short of them being more reasonable elsewhere, I think I'll just choose this option

Don Boyer · « **Reply #58 on:** April 11, 2012, 11:38:36 AM »

Quote from: Gareth on April 11, 2012, 11:18:47 AM

Yep, it appears to be just over $9 per deck in shipping - irrespective of how many your have (I only tried up to 8 decks... $72 in postage...).

So there's a choice I guess, $20 each at magictrickstore, or about $15.xx each posted slowly here

Or... skip them entirely... Short of them being more reasonable elsewhere, I think I'll just choose this option

I'm going to hold out and wait for a response to my email. I'll post the results.

sinsandman · « **Reply #59 on:** April 11, 2012, 12:45:36 PM »

Don, please do post up their response...could be a good thing. $15 is better than $20....ok that goes without saying

jmrock · « **Reply #60 on:** April 12, 2012, 02:45:20 AM »

I'll post you something funny... An absolute joke as a matter of fact... Look at how I received these BULL$#!T Decks of cards... In addition, I question whether or not they are authentic USPCC Playing Cards... They rather feel like cheap knockoffs - the box is very flimsy and the printing is piss poor... I have to tell you, holding this deck compared to any other deck of Bicycle Playing Cards I own feels different... the box and cellophane feel completely different... SMDH...

Edit: Somebody - Anybody please tell me what is going on with the amount of cellophane bunched up and poorly glued all over this deck...

Don Boyer · « **Reply #61 on:** April 12, 2012, 06:09:11 AM »

Quote from: sinsandman on April 11, 2012, 12:45:36 PM

Don, please do post up their response...could be a good thing. $15 is better than $20....ok that goes without saying

This is what I heard back:

Hi Don,

May I ask where you are located and what is the cost for the shipping?

The shipping rate is fixed and we are not the one who charged for the shipping fee. The shipping company charges for the postage. We will always look for the better courier with the better service and better deal.

Best,
Emily H.
SM Crew

This is what I replied:

I'm ordering from Yonkers, NY, a suburb of New York City. I also am a member of a message board of card collectors, magicians and flourishers, many of whom are from America, Europe and Asia, and there's a good deal of interest in this deck but the shipping costs are keeping people from ordering it.

We'll see what happens.

Quote from: jmrock on April 12, 2012, 02:45:20 AM

I'll post you something funny... An absolute joke as a matter of fact... Look at how I received these BULL$#!T Decks of cards... In addition, I question whether or not they are authentic USPCC Playing Cards... They rather feel like cheap knockoffs - the box is very flimsy and the printing is piss poor... I have to tell you, holding this deck compared to any other deck of Bicycle Playing Cards I own feels different... the box and cellophane feel completely different... SMDH...

Edit: Somebody - Anybody please tell me what is going on with the amount of cellophane bunched up and poorly glued all over this deck... In addition, there is just the most significant damage to the black deck and a banged in corner of the white deck... If you can make out the printing, it looks as if it was printed off a low resolution file... Absolutely shameful...

JM, I've seen this and worse from USPC, though I have to grant that printing on the box is awful. KT, you have them in hand - what are your thoughts? Real USPC or knockoff?

I'd contact the designers and complain. Maybe you'll get a replacement for the damaged ones.

Don Boyer · « **Reply #62 on:** April 17, 2012, 03:34:23 AM »

I nearly forgot to post what happened with my inquiry! They replied maybe a day or two later to say they'd sold out, rendering the shipping charges a moot point...

This guy's selling them for $10 a pack
http://aethercards.com/discourse/index.php?topic=2339.0

KT · « **Reply #63 on:** April 17, 2012, 06:25:04 AM »

Quote from: Don Boyer on April 12, 2012, 06:09:11 AM

KT, you have them in hand - what are your thoughts? Real USPC or knockoff?

I've only noticed that it was not printed by the USPC recently. Should have known
when I saw the poor packaging of the decks... They handle really bad.

I apologize to those who were mislead by my photos.

phantom1412 · « **Reply #64 on:** April 17, 2012, 06:59:32 AM »

Quote from: KT on April 17, 2012, 06:25:04 AM

Quote from: Don Boyer on April 12, 2012, 06:09:11 AM
KT, you have them in hand - what are your thoughts? Real USPC or knockoff?

I've only noticed that it was not printed by the USPC recently. Should have known
when I saw the poor packaging of the decks... They handle really bad.

I apologize to those who were mislead by my photos.

Thanks for the warning. I almost buy it when I saw it in Japanese store.

NathanCanadas · « **Reply #65 on:** April 17, 2012, 12:24:07 PM »

Quote from: KT on April 17, 2012, 06:25:04 AM

Quote from: Don Boyer on April 12, 2012, 06:09:11 AM
KT, you have them in hand - what are your thoughts? Real USPC or knockoff?

I've only noticed that it was not printed by the USPC recently. Should have known
when I saw the poor packaging of the decks... They handle really bad.

I apologize to those who were mislead by my photos.

I thought you weren't allowed to say a deck was air-cushion finish unless it is made by USPCC... ?

LeonJL · « **Reply #66 on:** April 17, 2012, 12:41:31 PM »

Got mine today, firstly, I would have to say the cellophane the deck is wrapped in is indeed bad, especially on the black ones. The main problem starts with the box. On the flap of the white box, there was the regular line of text that you can find on regular bicycle decks, but on the black box, there's nothing at all.
What's worse, the white box does say Bicycle, but i can't find any other signs that say this is a bicycle deck.

The cards themselves do fan, spread and faro but the quality is definitely not Q1 and could not be compared to other decks especially since it now costs over $10 for a single deck.

Don Boyer · « **Reply #67 on:** April 18, 2012, 02:30:32 AM »

Quote from: awretch on April 17, 2012, 12:41:31 PM

Got mine today, firstly, I would have to say the cellophane the deck is wrapped in is indeed bad, especially on the black ones. The main problem starts with the box. On the flap of the white box, there was the regular line of text that you can find on regular bicycle decks, but on the black box, there's nothing at all.
What's worse, the white box does say Bicycle, but i can't find any other signs that say this is a bicycle deck.

The cards themselves do fan, spread and faro but the quality is definitely not Q1 and could not be compared to other decks especially since it now costs over $10 for a single deck.

It looks like someone overseas was trying to fool the collectors' community AGAIN. Something just didn't pass the smell test on this one for me, especially when I saw what was going on with the prices.

thecardcollectors · « **Reply #68 on:** April 18, 2012, 07:19:22 AM »

We understand that these decks turned out to be somewhat of a disappointment, but if there're any other collectors out there who are still willing to get these for their design, we are selling them for USD9/deck or USD17/set (one Black and one White).

http://aethercards.com/discourse/index.php?topic=2269.0

Thanks again!

Don Boyer · « **Reply #69 on:** April 18, 2012, 11:23:08 PM »

Quote from: The_Card_Collectors on April 18, 2012, 07:19:22 AM

We understand that these decks turned out to be somewhat of a disappointment, but if there're any other collectors out there who are still willing to get these for their design, we are selling them for USD9/deck or USD17/set (one Black and one White).

http://aethercards.com/discourse/index.php?topic=2269.0

Thanks again!

If you don't mind, who is "we"? The general rule here is one person, one account.

Were you involved in the making of this deck, or are you simply selling it?

I actually liked the design, and am disappointed about these quality issues, especially with how there was so much hype put out there in an effort to drive the price up. Asia Magic Shop on FB was not very forthcoming about their identities. In retrospect, it sounds shady.

munro159 · « **Reply #70 on:** April 18, 2012, 11:51:25 PM »

I unfortunately loved the design on these. I loved them enough to order a mixed brick from overseas! Now to hear about the quality issues of these.....it makes me quite angry. Although the place I bought these from didn't mention anything in their listing about these being made by USPC so....I guess its my own fault! On the up-side....maybe these will become a novelty one day! I'm crossing my fingers hoping maybe my decks aren't that bad!

thecardcollectors · « **Reply #71 on:** April 19, 2012, 04:15:07 AM »

Hi Don,

I would like to introduce myself - My name is Joyce, and I have an online shop called The Card Collectors on Facebook. I'm simply selling the decks, and was not involved in the making of these decks. I still have no idea who made them actually.

Like many others, I was very much disappointed when I saw the quality of the packaging, but will still stand by the fact that they have a cool design nonetheless!

Dudeee · « **Reply #72 on:** April 19, 2012, 09:10:40 AM »

I have to say I fell in love with the design that I got a brick from the local shop too. I was a little luckier in the sense that I was early and I got to pick the best of the lot. I actually went through 5 bricks to pick up the best 12 decks, although the decks that I have do not have any dents, but the plastic were all crappy......

Don Boyer · « **Reply #73 on:** April 19, 2012, 11:17:15 AM »

Quote from: munro159 on April 18, 2012, 11:51:25 PM

I unfortunately loved the design on these. I loved them enough to order a mixed brick from overseas! Now to hear about the quality issues of these.....it makes me quite angry. Although the place I bought these from didn't mention anything in their listing about these being made by USPC so....I guess its my own fault! On the up-side....maybe these will become a novelty one day! I'm crossing my fingers hoping maybe my decks aren't that bad!

Take examples from real life as to what becomes collectible and what doesn't. It's not always the best-looking or best-made things that become the rare and valuable ones.

One of the most valuable Star Wars action figures isn't the really cool looking ones, nor is it a major character. When the Jawa was first released, it came with a chintzy-looking cape made of vinyl. This was quickly pulled from production, and the cape was replaced with a stitched-cloth cloak which looked a hundred times better. But it's the one with the vinyl cap that fetches hundreds of dollars today while the other one is hardly noticed and only worth a fraction of that.

The most valuable Star Wars poster isn't some heroic painting that hung in displays at movie theaters, but a drawn poster by comic book artist Howard Chaykin that was sold at a comic book convention a year before the film's release for $1.75. It was the first, it is the rarest, and it now sells for thousands.

http://movieposterauthenticating.com/wordpress/star-wars-us/star-wars-first-poster-the-chaykin/

Your "bogus deck" of today can become tomorrow's rare classic. But there's no way of knowing without a crystal ball, a time machine or a deep connection to the living Force...

Quote from: The_Card_Collectors on April 19, 2012, 04:15:07 AM

Hi Don,

I would like to introduce myself - My name is Joyce, and I have an online shop called The Card Collectors on Facebook. I'm simply selling the decks, and was not involved in the making of these decks. I still have no idea who made them actually.

Like many others, I was very much disappointed when I saw the quality of the packaging, but will still stand by the fact that they have a cool design nonetheless!

Nice to meet you, Joyce, and welcome to the Discourse. Make yourself at home.

Quote from: Dudeee on April 19, 2012, 09:10:40 AM

I have to say I fell in love with the design that I got a brick from the local shop too. I was a little luckier in the sense that I was early and I got to pick the best of the lot. I actually went through 5 bricks to pick up the best 12 decks, although the decks that I have do not have any dents, but the plastic were all crappy......

What, exactly, is your take on the quality of the cards themselves, and not the packaging?

This really looks like a case of an excellent design in the hands of a terrible card-print shop, or at least one that's not up to the standards we're used to around here. I'd be really curious to know more about who printed it and who designed it.

LeonJL · « **Reply #74 on:** April 19, 2012, 11:39:32 AM »

Quote from: Don Boyer on April 19, 2012, 11:17:15 AM

What, exactly, is your take on the quality of the cards themselves, and not the packaging?

This really looks like a case of an excellent design in the hands of a terrible card-print shop, or at least one that's not up to the standards we're used to around here. I'd be really curious to know more about who printed it and who designed it.

I've been playing with mine for 2 days now and to be honest, it really isn't as bad as the first impression I got from the box and packaging. Although they might be some USPC knockoff, once broken into, they actually handle pretty well and i've got no problems doing fans, spreads and faro too. Not bad for a knockoff IMO.

One thing I'm still curious, the side says Maxwell Playing Card Company, any ideas?

NathanCanadas · « **Reply #75 on:** April 19, 2012, 12:41:16 PM »

Quote from: awretch on April 19, 2012, 11:39:32 AM

Quote from: Don Boyer on April 19, 2012, 11:17:15 AM
What, exactly, is your take on the quality of the cards themselves, and not the packaging?

This really looks like a case of an excellent design in the hands of a terrible card-print shop, or at least one that's not up to the standards we're used to around here. I'd be really curious to know more about who printed it and who designed it.

I've been playing with mine for 2 days now and to be honest, it really isn't as bad as the first impression I got from the box and packaging. Although they might be some USPC knockoff, once broken into, they actually handle pretty well and i've got no problems doing fans, spreads and faro too. Not bad for a knockoff IMO.

One thing I'm still curious, the side says Maxwell Playing Card Company, any ideas?

Here's what I've found for Maxwell Playing Card Company. Not much.
http://www.vliegeruit.com/osc/maxwell-playing-card-m-1530.html

Don Boyer · « **Reply #76 on:** April 19, 2012, 02:19:39 PM »

After hearing from 52cartes via Facebook, I decided that there's too many questions about this deck and did some research. I just got off the phone with Tiffany Mahan at USPC about this deck.

She stated that while it's possible that someone may have printed a bogus run, this was indeed a USPC-made product, probably for an international customer. There was more than one print run of it, and the last she's aware of was in 2008. The lack of legal text on some of the box flaps is consistent with the company policy that was in effect at the time, so boxes with the legal text are probably from a preceding print run.

Assuming that a counterfeiter didn't make a copy of this deck recently, the quality issues that people are now experiencing are more likely due to improper long-term storage of the decks under excessively warm temperatures. It would affect the cellophane wrapping and the cards themselves negatively.

If you have any issues regarding a Pandora Vine Backs deck you've received, she stated that she'd be happy to look into the problem, and requests that you mail the deck(s) in question to her:

USPC
300 Gap Way
Erlanger, KY 41018
UNITED STATES
Attn.: Tiffany Mahan

I consider it very unlikely that some counterfeiter would make copies of an relatively-unknown deck like this when so many riper and more valuable targets abound, and the simplest explanation in this case is probably the correct one - it's an old deck that sat in the back of a hot warehouse for too long. I'm still interested in getting some for myself, but not at the outrageous prices some shops have been charging. We have guys right here on the Discourse selling them for under $10 a pack, some for way under.

Nathan, that site you found doesn't appear to be the Maxwell Playing Card Company. It appears to be a northern European online shop that simply chose to list the item with the company name that appears on the side of the box. Tiffany said as much when she saw it.

EDIT: I want to give a big thank-you to 52cartes (Google Translate English version here)- he was the one who brought this to my attention in the first place and motivated me to track this problem down and get answers.

LeonJL · « **Reply #77 on:** April 19, 2012, 02:44:06 PM »

Well, that does explain why the cards themselves do handle better once broken into. Maybe everyone who got the decks (myself included) was too bias when we saw the condition of the packaging and didn't really break into the deck enough and give it a chance. Given the fact that it might have stored for a while, I'm now glad to say that the cards themselves are not warped in any way, at least the ones I got wasn't. So it seems just the box themselves are affected.

Another thing, does this mean the Pandora Vine Backs are out of print and what is on the market is all that's remaining? How many print runs were there exactly? Any estimates on how many of these decks are in circulation?

Divided Mind · « **Reply #78 on:** April 19, 2012, 04:05:23 PM »

This is odd. I got a few of the white decks, and they honestly look like they just shipped from the factory. The cellophane is in great shape. No tears, wear, no rips, or dents.

So, did I just get lucky?

sinsandman · « **Reply #79 on:** April 19, 2012, 04:15:27 PM »

Don, thank you for doing so much research on these. It sounds like what we have may be a fairly rare deck that is no longer able to be had. That would explain the quick sale outs. The fact that once they are broke in they handle well speaks well of the deck. Interesting indeed

Don Boyer · « **Reply #80 on:** April 20, 2012, 12:25:33 AM »

Quote from: awretch on April 19, 2012, 02:44:06 PM

Another thing, does this mean the Pandora Vine Backs are out of print and what is on the market is all that's remaining? How many print runs were there exactly? Any estimates on how many of these decks are in circulation?

The last print run was in '08. But there was more than one print run - and potentially, the owner of the design could create more. Tiffany didn't have those details for me, I'm afraid, stating that it was an international order, so I'm assuming that either the didn't have access to those details or wasn't at liberty to share them.

Quote from: Divided Mind on April 19, 2012, 04:05:23 PM

This is odd. I got a few of the white decks, and they honestly look like they just shipped from the factory. The cellophane is in great shape. No tears, wear, no rips, or dents.

So, did I just get lucky?

Lucky sounds about right.

Quote from: sinsandman on April 19, 2012, 04:15:27 PM

Don, thank you for doing so much research on these. It sounds like what we have may be a fairly rare deck that is no longer able to be had. That would explain the quick sale outs. The fact that once they are broke in they handle well speaks well of the deck. Interesting indeed

I don't know about rare, really. I just know it's a deck that's had at least two print runs and could potentially have more. I wish someone who owns one (HINT-HINT-HINT) would print DETAILED PHOTOS of the box, AoS, etc. so we can find out more about this deck...

LeonJL · « **Reply #81 on:** April 20, 2012, 01:24:27 AM »

The boxes have limited info on them, and when I say limited, I mean REALLY limited. See for youself, no year, barcode, anything whatsoever. The bottom just says "Looking for something?"

The AoS didn't have anything written on them other than :PANDORA, VINE BACKS. (see photos posted by KT on page 2) all the court cards, face cards, jokers and even gaffs are exactly the same.

Don Boyer · « **Reply #82 on:** April 20, 2012, 02:35:01 AM »

A quick Google search at Magicpedia turned up Mike Maxwell, a publisher/magician. Could this be his personal deck?

I'm betting this was a magician's personal deck, not really intended for resale in the first place, and someone just found a buttload of them in a back room...

sinsandman · « **Reply #83 on:** April 20, 2012, 07:17:56 PM »

Ok...Let's get down to business with a review

I am lucky enough to have scored some of the decks that had good cello and no damage apparently. Let's start with the white deck;

Design: I am liking the back design here. The vine design is detailed enough to draw attention but simple enough to not scream "Look at me!!"
All the pips are custom as well as every ace. So this is a fully custom deck. The court cards are sick as well. They sport deep colors and very contrasting eyes with a purple glow.....

you know what....I am more of a video review kind of guy. I'm just going to say this. The stock is thin and great for springs and the likes. It fanned quite well right out of the box. and here are some pics. The gaff cards are not the same either. The white contains the pictured queen card and a double backer (white/black). And the black deck contains the ace/3 cards.

Gared_Crawford · « **Reply #84 on:** May 12, 2012, 10:51:24 PM »

Hello All,

I just did a Google search for "Pandora Vine Backs" and I found this thread. It would seem that there is quite a bit of speculation going on about this deck. Hopefully I can answer all questions you might have about the deck.

First things first: I designed this deck. Before the market was flooded with custom decks(other than ellusionist and T11 decks) I decided to design a custom deck that I myself would like using and perhaps other magicians as well. I started this process back in 2007 as a fun side project. I am a professional violinist by trade and for the last 5 years I have been the concertmaster of the Evansville Philharmonic in Evansville, IN. So with limited time on my hands it took me a while to actually complete the designs as I was doing it in my spare time...it drove my girlfriend nuts!

Once I had the design completed I contacted the USPCC. I'd like to note that going into this project I was completely ignorant as to how things were done at the USPCC and I even explained that to them. The weird thing is that, knowing it was my first time doing business with them, they gave me almost zero information about what my options were. I.E...they didn't tell me that there were two different presses at the factory...they told me nothing about the quality ratings ( Q3, Q1...)...different finishes...not to mention a bunch of other crucial information that would have helped in making these decks a more successful product.

The initial idea was to have these printed for my own use. At that time the minimum order was 1,000 decks of cards. The sales rep that was assigned to my order only told me that much...they failed to mention that they would be printed on the sheet fed press...or ANYTHING about multiple presses AT ALL. So I thought to myself...."hmmm...I have two designs(black and white)...I wonder if they would print 500 hundred of each?" So I asked the sales rep and he said "Yes...yeah sure we can do that for you" Little did I know and apparently him either, that it had to be a minimum of 1000 per design. So he gave me an inaccurate quote based on the 500/500 idea.

One more important factor came into play here. I placed my order with them literally weeks before they were about to move to their new facility in Erlanger, KY. It is also important to note that I had no idea they were relocating or that the sheet-fed press at the new facility would yield much nicer decks...and remember, as far as I knew, there was only one press that they printed everything on.

So I go off to play in the Missouri Symphony for the summer and while there I get a call from the lady in the custom deck division. She says "Hi Gared, we've finished printing your decks. There are 1,190 black decks and 1,220 white decks! Your total is $@,#%&!"

All of a sudden I am handed a bill for more than twice the amount of cards I was expecting to get. I don't know if any of you have printed decks with USPCC but when the do a run...it is normal for them to over run and produce more than you ordered. So what happened here was that my sales rep was misinformed...he also didn't communicate with the press team at all because if he had told them I wanted 500 of each deck...they would have laughed in his face and said "Dude!...the minimum is 1,000 decks. Call your client back and tell them that they need to budget for and be expecting 2,000 decks!" But of course this never occurred...so the press team just did what they were supposed to and printed roughly 1,000 of each. Keep in mind here that I essentially signed a contract with them that stated I would be getting 500 of each deck and that I would pay for said decks. I had the numbers in writing.

After explaining my situation to the woman in charge or the custom division...we reached an agreement that I would pay a reduced amount for all the extra decks that I wasn't expecting to get. I was still out quite a bit more than I had budgeted for...but at least the cards were finished.

So the cards were shipped to my home in Evansville (a friend signed for the delivery) and on one of my days off I drove back home to check them out.

When I opened one of the bricks of white cards I was shocked to find that not only was the cellophane job on at least half of them atrocious...but the finish was nothing like what I was expecting...I had asked for a high emboss and what I got was nearly a smooth finish like Aladdins but with a much inferior coating on them. Also the artwork was somehow altered...as if they had screwed up the transparency levels of the different layers in my photoshop file. So then I opened a brick of the black ones to find the same problem with the cellophane but was relieved to see that at least the artwork look pretty much how it should and the finish was just OK. I had also requested seal stickers and none of the decks had those either.

I contacted the USPCC and gave them my complaints. I also quickly read over the contract to see what my options for returning them was. They asked me to send them two bad decks so they could see what I was talking about. After talking to many people and several mild arguments I had at least convinced them to take back the white decks and reprint them. They refused to reprint the black decks because they said they thought they looked and handled fine. I should also mention that I was sent some proof sheets right before the decks were printed that looked nothing like the decks that I eventually received. The proofs looked perfect. I even had to sign off on these proofs saying that they looked correct and then send it back to them.

They eventually reprinted the White decks...but this time it was done in the new facility in Erlanger. I actually drove to KY to pick them up myself and return the defective white decks. When I got there I was quick to open one and inspect it. I was pleased with the deck. The difference was stunning so much so that the new White decks were now of a noticeably higher quality than the black decks that they refused to reprint...this was annoying to say the least. I pleaded with them one more time about reprinting the black decks as well but they still refused. One of the printing guys that I spoke with even claimed that he had warned me to wait until they moved to the new facility to have my decks printed because the Cincinnati sheet-fed press was apparently an old piece of junk that was on it's last leg. He of course never said this to me...maybe he meant to. I definitely would have taken his advice...I mean think about it...if you were about to invest thousands of dollars in cards...wouldn't you heed the warning of an "expert" to insure that you got the best possible product in the end?

Anyway...that's pretty much the whole story. It was an undesirable experience for me to say the least. It left a bad taste in my mouth. I think it was just a bit of bad timing and bad luck. Fortunately things are supposed to be much better now that the USPCC has settled into the new facility. They used to say that if you wanted good cards you should have them printed on the WEB press...but now you can get very good cards off the new Sheet-fed press and a lot of smaller run custom decks are being printed on said press.

I'm glad to hear that people actually like the design. The good news is that I have cleaned it up quite a bit to make it a bit more striking...and I've also redesigned the tuck cases and court cards. If I do have them reprinted you can look forward to them having a nicer finish and improved artwork. I also have about 5 other designs that could be printed some day. I consider this one to be the most unique though. The other designs are more classical in nature.

I'd also like to say that this project was never about making money for me. I love cards and I liked the idea of having my own design printed. I have no control over how much people are selling them for. I just sold what I had left to Murphy's Magic Supplies and barely made back the money I spent on them. I do feel very strongly though that a deck of cards (even custom) should never cost more than $5. Maybe $6 but I think that is pushing it. I've considered submitting my design to the newly unveiled HOPC website in hopes that they could be printed properly some day. And I would do what ever I could to keep the costs down...I want people to use them and enjoy them...not worry about how much they cost.

I must say though that now that there are so many custom decks I'm kind of losing my interest a bit. Like one of you said "they are all starting to blend together"...I agree. If I had known there would be so many black and white deck sets I would have considered going down a different road. That being said I have the vineBack design in about 20 different colors ready to go. I believe even if the design is very modern it should still retain some the classical traits and form that decks like Bikes and Aladdin's have. I.E....white borders and standard format pips....and I must say that I still prefer court cards that have the border on the face as well.

If you guys are interested I could post some pics of the updated design.

All the best,
Gared Crawford

sinsandman · « **Reply #85 on:** May 12, 2012, 11:11:47 PM »

I, for one, would love to see whatever you have to show.

Jin Jian · « **Reply #86 on:** May 13, 2012, 12:05:46 AM »

Nice story you have .. and also if it possible pls show me your design

NathanCanadas · « **Reply #87 on:** May 13, 2012, 12:34:37 AM »

First of all, welcome to the forums! It seems you've had a rough experience, but I'd be glad to see what else you have in store for us!

Don Boyer · « **Reply #88 on:** May 13, 2012, 12:47:52 AM »

Welcome aboard, Gared! If you have more designs for potential decks, post away on the Design & Development board - I'm sure you'd have no shortage of people interested in seeing them around here.

Dudeee · « **Reply #89 on:** May 13, 2012, 12:59:15 AM »

Personally the deck looks nice to me, and I'm glad that there's now some clarity to the history of the cards.

I wonder how did the decks end up in Asia?

Did USPCC comment on why the crappy packages?

Gared_Crawford · « **Reply #90 on:** May 13, 2012, 05:32:00 AM »

As far as the poor cellophane job goes...my guess is that these cards were finished just as they were clearing out the Cincinnati factory. At that point I think their total operation was in complete chaos. And right after that they had quite a turn around of personnel from what I'm told.

Gared_Crawford · « **Reply #91 on:** May 13, 2012, 06:40:55 AM »

Here's a peek at the updated design.

frostchew · « **Reply #92 on:** May 13, 2012, 12:30:38 PM »

Quote from: Dudeee on May 13, 2012, 12:59:15 AM

Personally the deck looks nice to me, and I'm glad that there's now some clarity to the history of the cards.

I wonder how did the decks end up in Asia?

Did USPCC comment on why the crappy packages?

Gared mentioned that he sold off the bulk remaining of his stash to Murphy's Magic Supplies, which is a magic wholesale company in the USA that sells only to retailers. I suppose the major resellers in our region got hold of the decks from MMS.

Jin Jian · « **Reply #93 on:** May 13, 2012, 01:16:24 PM »

are the deck design the same ?? is it just a second run ?

Gared_Crawford · « **Reply #94 on:** May 13, 2012, 01:55:31 PM »

They have been modified quite a bit. The outer borders have been removed to increase the size of the actual image. I also did a lot of intricate outlining and shadows to make the vines stand out more from the background and the center rings. All the court cards are new and the Aces have been visually embossed to add depth. Obviously the tuck cases are different as well. It's not quite finished but it should look a lot nicer than the originals.

NathanCanadas · « **Reply #95 on:** May 13, 2012, 01:55:54 PM »

Quote from: Jin Jian on May 13, 2012, 01:16:24 PM

are the deck design the same ?? is it just a second run ?

Please make sure to read the comments above before asking a question. Gared Crawford is the designer of the deck and those are some updates on his original design. These aren't actually on the Vine backs, but he is considering printing some different versions with different designs and colors.

Edit: Mr. Crawford beat me to it.

Jin Jian · « **Reply #96 on:** May 13, 2012, 02:13:57 PM »

Quote from: NathanCanadas on May 13, 2012, 01:55:54 PM

Quote from: Jin Jian on May 13, 2012, 01:16:24 PM
are the deck design the same ?? is it just a second run ?
Please make sure to read the comments above before asking a question. Gared Crawford is the designer of the deck and those are some updates on his original design. These aren't actually on the Vine backs, but he is considering printing some different versions with different designs and colors.

Edit: Mr. Crawford beat me to it.

Please also make sure to read the comment above before saying something .. if i did not read his story how could i say nice story bro in the above post ?? let me give you advice do not people to keep quite when you yourself are talking .. that what my teachers always say to my classmate ..

what i was trying to do is asking the designer what is the change in design .. since i do not own any vine backs playing cards and the picture he provided is not really details so i could not compare with the 1st version

Gared_Crawford · « **Reply #97 on:** May 13, 2012, 04:19:03 PM »

Here are some pics comparing the original design with the new ones. You should be able to see a lot more clarity in the vines and background of the modified back design. The originals are on the left. You must click to view the full size image to really see what I am talking about.

Eyeball · « **Reply #98 on:** May 13, 2012, 06:07:19 PM »

Quote from: Gared_Crawford on May 13, 2012, 04:19:03 PM

Here are some pics comparing the original design with the new ones. You should be able to see a lot more clarity in the vines and background of the modified back design. The originals are on the left. You must click to view the full size image to really see what I am talking about.

I would love to see these new improved designs get printed, I really liked the decks when I first saw them but all the complaints with the package, handling, etc, made me not want to get them. Hopefully you are able to do another print run sometime in the future. The new design focuses much more on the central part of the card (the vines coming together to make the main symbol) and I like that a lot.