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Dudeee · « **on:** March 25, 2012, 08:42:26 AM »

I just got my hands on what I believe are 1st and 2nd editions of the black bee stingers deck.
Just wanted to confirm, are the only differences the addresses on the bottom of the tuck box? One says Ohio and the other Kentucky?
Cos I viewed an eBay auction and it stated Erlanger on the bottom, but mine says Ohio.

Any idea how much are they going for?

Siegismyname · « **Reply #1 on:** March 25, 2012, 09:01:52 AM »

Dudeee. U are finally here. Welcome aboard. I believe the only diff from the outside is only the address. As for the price, I would say prob around 35 and 20 USD respectively.

digipunk · « **Reply #2 on:** March 25, 2012, 09:38:56 AM »

The boxes are different, the left one is an Ohio Stinger.

Dudeee · « **Reply #3 on:** March 25, 2012, 10:40:25 AM »

I tried to look at the texture of both the tuck boxes but I can't make out the differences.

Digipunk, does the left deck state Ohio and the right state Erlanger on the bottom of the box?

Don Boyer · « **Reply #4 on:** March 25, 2012, 02:18:26 PM »

They're not different versions, just different print runs. They did the same exact thing with Propaganda decks. The original run was printed before the move to Kentucky, the run after that was made in Erlanger.

A supposedly rare deck, sold out on T11's site, shows up in the aftermarket as a new printing all too often for me to believe their true rarity.

I do like the Kentucky deck box, though - the textured finish is like an air-cushion card. They did the same thing for version 2 of the EATCT deck.

NathanCanadas · « **Reply #5 on:** March 25, 2012, 11:24:14 PM »

I actually didn't know the black Bee Stingers had ever been printed in Erlanger. Good to know! I personally prefer the box from the first print though. And welcome to the forums, Dudeeeee!!!!

digipunk · « **Reply #6 on:** March 26, 2012, 04:45:40 AM »

Quote from: NathanCanadas on March 25, 2012, 11:24:14 PM

I actually didn't know the black Bee Stingers had ever been printed in Erlanger. Good to know! I personally prefer the box from the first print though. And welcome to the forums, Dudeeeee!!!!

You're kidding, right? The deck I sent to you was made in Erlanger KY.

Quote from: Dudeee on March 25, 2012, 10:40:25 AM

I tried to look at the texture of both the tuck boxes but I can't make out the differences.
Digipunk, does the left deck state Ohio and the right state Erlanger on the bottom of the box?

Both state Erlanger on the bottom, but you may find something different (pic-2)
and the jokers in the left box state "CINCINNATI, OHIO 45212" (pic-3).

Don Boyer · « **Reply #7 on:** March 26, 2012, 04:55:16 AM »

Actually, that difference is explained easily enough.

As they were transitioning from Ohio to Kentucky, some decks were placed in the packaging of the other location. For example, if you find a pack of Tally Ho labeled "Cincinnati, Ohio" on the side, but sealed with a black deck seal, there's a roughly even chance it was actually made in Kentucky and placed in an Ohio box during the period when they were gradually shifting operations from one plant to the other.

In this case, I'd wager that the first print run, the one on the left, was made in Ohio, but either
a) the boxes were already printed with Kentucky on them or
b) they simply didn't get packaged until the printed stock was moved to the new plant or
c) both - some decks were a) while some were b)

Is it possible that the first print run was made in Kentucky? Sure, but not likely. The only way I could see that being the case would be if the printing plates were made with Ohio on them but the print job couldn't take place until after the move to Kentucky. Regardless, it's a near-certainty that the second run was indeed a Kentucky-made deck.

Linguist_ · « **Reply #8 on:** March 26, 2012, 06:17:35 AM »

Just had a wee look at my own and sure enough all the signs are there: smooth box, 'All rights reserved...' starting on a new line; and the 'Cincinnati, Ohio' on the Joker! While personally I'm not really for the whole Ohio printed decks being higher value, it seems the market in general does like that, and so it's good to know my Stingers just got a wee boost in their value. If I ever sell them I'll be sure to say 'RARE LIMITED OHIO V1s!1!!!1'

.

Nah, in all seriousness though, this is useful to know. It's the subtle information like that which really makes knowledge about your deck collection unique and diverse. Now I just need to find 'v2', textured box Bee Stingers. Let's just hope the eBay sellers don't mind me asking 'can you take a macro picture of the box's texture as well as the copyright info on the bottom?' when I get round to making sure!

Dudeee · « **Reply #9 on:** March 26, 2012, 08:32:57 AM »

Guys Guys Guys!!!

Did you read the first post???

I have decks where it's says Cincinnati Ohio on the bottom of the box instead of Erlanger Kentucky!!!

Are my cards freaks? Or just freaking rare???

I don't have a computer, so I can't upload a pic of the bottom of the box.
If anybody wants, PM me your email and I can email you a pic to upload.

Or if anyone has a pic, please upload.

Don Boyer · « **Reply #10 on:** March 26, 2012, 09:50:13 AM »

If your box says Ohio on the bottom, then maybe it was the first of THREE printings. Not unheard of with T11. The bizarre thing is that they'll continue listing this deck as sold out on their site while other retailers are selling the new printings.

No matter how you slice it, though, it's still all the same version. Bizarre, but true. If you're curious for more info, perhaps emailing T11 customer service will clear it up.

NathanCanadas · « **Reply #11 on:** March 26, 2012, 10:22:07 AM »

Quote from: digipunk on March 26, 2012, 04:45:40 AM

Quote from: NathanCanadas on March 25, 2012, 11:24:14 PM
I actually didn't know the black Bee Stingers had ever been printed in Erlanger. Good to know! I personally prefer the box from the first print though. And welcome to the forums, Dudeeeee!!!!
You're kidding, right? The deck I sent to you was made in Erlanger KY.

Typo. I meant Cincinatti

digipunk · « **Reply #12 on:** March 26, 2012, 04:00:20 PM »

Quote from: Dudeee on March 26, 2012, 08:32:57 AM

Guys Guys Guys!!!
Did you read the first post???
I have decks where it's says Cincinnati Ohio on the bottom of the box instead of Erlanger Kentucky!!!

I knew, I didn't mention that because it is too obvious that they were produced in Ohio, nothing interesting

According to my experience of handling these decks, the cards are all the same.

Dudeee · « **Reply #13 on:** March 26, 2012, 08:52:16 PM »

Firstly, I would like to say that the increase in price does not matter to me, I just want to know the history of my card collection.

I have just asked T11 about this, they have said that the boxes with Ohio addresses were printed in Ohio and therefore the Kentucky boxes were printed in Kentucky.

According to them, there should not have any differences in stock or finish.

But I just asked them another question, why does the smooth finish box with the Kentucky address have the Aces of Spade stating Ohio on it?

I will post the answers when I get them.

Don Boyer · « **Reply #14 on:** March 27, 2012, 03:09:06 AM »

Quote from: Dudeee on March 26, 2012, 08:52:16 PM

Firstly, I would like to say that the increase in price does not matter to me, I just want to know the history of my card collection.

I have just asked T11 about this, they have said that the boxes with Ohio addresses were printed in Ohio and therefore the Kentucky boxes were printed in Kentucky.

According to them, there should not have any differences in stock or finish.

But I just asked them another question, why does the smooth finish box with the Kentucky address have the Aces of Spade stating Ohio on it?

I will post the answers when I get them.

Awesome. We're all looking forward to hearing the answers. Perhaps you can learn how many print runs of this deck were actually made, and maybe the total quantity? I'm guessing they won't want to reveal that, but it couldn't hurt to try.

The whole concept of a deck being out of stock on their site because it was so rare and suddenly turning up in MULTIPLE print runs in the aftermarket just sounds really suspicious - it would have the effect of artificially inflating the aftermarket price for those who think only the first print run should get top dollar. At least with the Propaganda deck, the additional decks were clearly identified as being a different run - but the fact that the box clearly read the city of manufacture on the side like a box of Standard Bikes probably had a lot to do with that. And don't even get me started on "Ohio" cards in Kentucky boxes...

NathanCanadas · « **Reply #15 on:** March 27, 2012, 02:05:52 PM »

Quote from: Dudeee on March 26, 2012, 08:52:16 PM

Firstly, I would like to say that the increase in price does not matter to me, I just want to know the history of my card collection.

I have just asked T11 about this, they have said that the boxes with Ohio addresses were printed in Ohio and therefore the Kentucky boxes were printed in Kentucky.

According to them, there should not have any differences in stock or finish.

But I just asked them another question, why does the smooth finish box with the Kentucky address have the Aces of Spade stating Ohio on it?

I will post the answers when I get them.

Good to know! Can you also ask them how many where printed in which place, so we can know which ones are more rare.

Don Boyer · « **Reply #16 on:** March 28, 2012, 12:31:50 AM »

Quote from: NathanCanadas on March 27, 2012, 02:05:52 PM

Quote from: Dudeee on March 26, 2012, 08:52:16 PM
Firstly, I would like to say that the increase in price does not matter to me, I just want to know the history of my card collection.

I have just asked T11 about this, they have said that the boxes with Ohio addresses were printed in Ohio and therefore the Kentucky boxes were printed in Kentucky.

According to them, there should not have any differences in stock or finish.

But I just asked them another question, why does the smooth finish box with the Kentucky address have the Aces of Spade stating Ohio on it?

I will post the answers when I get them.
Good to know! Can you also ask them how many where printed in which place, so we can know which ones are more rare.

It would be great to know that, but I doubt they'd release that detailed a level of information. They might not even reveal the total number printed in both locations in all print runs.

Dudeee · « **Reply #17 on:** March 30, 2012, 11:58:13 AM »

I think T11 themselves are very confused, so confused until they didn't reply the last question even after 2 reminders, maybe someone else should ask about it.

All they said in the first and only reply was that the box with Ohio printed on the bottom were printed in Ohio and the ones printed Kentucky on the bottom were printed in Kentucky... DUHhhh...... and that the quality is the same.

Here comes the difficult question.
If the above is true about the prints, then why would the smooth finished box with Kentucky printed on the bottom feature an Ace of Spades with Ohio printed on it???
Confused??? Me too.....

I hope someone knows someone in T11 who can find out the answer and share it with us, the very people who buys heaps of their cards and products.....

Don Boyer · « **Reply #18 on:** March 31, 2012, 02:32:52 AM »

I once inquired at D&D about activity in message boards, and was told that they specifically do NOT check out or post on the community boards. It could be that T11 has the same policy, since I don't recall ever seeing a T11 rep on here.

Dudeee · « **Reply #19 on:** April 03, 2012, 11:54:38 PM »

I finally got an answer from the T11 folks, this was their reply.

"There were likely multiple printings of this deck at the new factory in Kentucky. If you see a deck that has a tuck case labeled with Kentucky and an ace of spades labeled with Ohio, this deck would have been printed in Kentucky, and the design on the ace of spades had not yet been changed."

I can now say that if it says Ohio on the bottom, the deck was printed in Cincinnati and vice versa.

Having said that, there is at least 2 variations of the Erlanger prints, differences are the box texture and the Ace of Spades. I hope that will shed some light on the order in which you place your cards on the display.