Author (Read 14691 times)

CBJ · « **on:** November 27, 2011, 10:49:37 AM »

via 52cartes

www.encarded.com

The site reads:
"The world of playing cards is full of amazing cards, but even with the variety currently available, there are ideas that no one has produced, designs that no one has seen, and features that no one has considered yet. Encarded is dedicated to exploring some of these new ideas in playing card design. Initially funded by the amazing Kickstarter platform, we want to make really cool things that any card collector, cardist or magician would be excited to have."

"Here is a teaser image of a prototype design for Tendril…

ABOUT:
"Encarded is a new venture that designs and produces fully custom playing cards. Thanks to social funding like Kickstarter, we can make what used to be an unrealistic dream a reality. Based in beautiful Sarasota, Florida, Encarded is founded by a long-time graphic designer who was inspired to create some new and exciting things in the world of playing cards. Paul Carpenter (lead designer) collects cards, does a little cardistry on the side, spends time with his wife and children and tries to get some sun at Siesta Key Beach whenever possible."

More custom decks on the way... can the market handle it?

CBJ

cosmicsecret · « **Reply #1 on:** November 27, 2011, 11:34:15 AM »

Well,so many new custom decks companies comming out...some might say it´s a curse and some might say it´s a bless.
More designs who might appeal to you - on the backside more money to spend to fulfill the desire of getting the latest deck in vogue.
My opinion is - the more quality designed decks to choose from is good for the customers and also for the compettion.
It helps to raise the bar in terms of custom decks (i.e. ,Alex with his Vortex Deck and Lance T. Millers take on creating playing cards).

If the design is not appealing to the masses - no one will spend his money.

Let´s see what Encarded will show off with

xZEROx · « **Reply #2 on:** November 27, 2011, 11:42:47 AM »

looks like it's the design for their ace of spades.
i like the color combination though.

Evan · « **Reply #3 on:** November 27, 2011, 12:07:38 PM »

The kickstarter hasn't launched yet so the Kickstarter will probably run through next year! So after the holidays (when we get money) they will be available

KPopFever605 · « **Reply #4 on:** November 27, 2011, 01:28:49 PM »

It looks like the Vortex's illegitimate child.

xela · « **Reply #5 on:** November 27, 2011, 03:12:12 PM »

Paul Carpenter - isn't that xmetal?

loldudex2 · « **Reply #6 on:** November 27, 2011, 03:13:17 PM »

Quote from: alex. on November 27, 2011, 03:12:12 PM

Paul Carpenter - isn't that xmetal?

I was going to say, the background of that photo looks VERY familiar.

Paul Carpenter · « **Reply #7 on:** November 27, 2011, 06:33:39 PM »

Yeah, that's me.

While not necessarily playing cards, I've been looking for a creative outlet/project for years and this is a perfect fit. Seeing that you can be successful in this, like the great stuff Alex and Lance are soon inspired me to give it a try.

I don't really want to compete, really, but I have some ideas that I personally would like to have, and hopefully other people will like it too. Worth a shot!

It'll take a little while to get everything together, finish designs, work though the numbers and all that, but I'm pretty excited about trying.

loldudex2 · « **Reply #8 on:** November 27, 2011, 06:39:17 PM »

Quote from: xmetal on November 27, 2011, 06:33:39 PM

Yeah, that's me.

While not necessarily playing cards, I've been looking for a creative outlet/project for years and this is a perfect fit. Seeing that you can be successful in this, like the great stuff Alex and Lance are soon inspired me to give it a try.

I don't really want to compete, really, but I have some ideas that I personally would like to have, and hopefully other people will like it too. Worth a shot!

It'll take a little while to get everything together, finish designs, work though the numbers and all that, but I'm pretty excited about trying.

Good luck! I will pick some up, but could you please release them next year, when the deck printing has slowed down.

xela · « **Reply #9 on:** November 27, 2011, 06:45:24 PM »

Paul I really can't wait to see what you have in store. By all means use this site to promote your work. My personal advice is to hold off on a Kickstarter for a few weeks. Launch during a dry spell for the best chance at success.

Evan · « **Reply #10 on:** November 27, 2011, 06:57:42 PM »

I agree with Alex. Definitely wait 2-4 weeks.
Idk about all of you but I have no money now because of all these recent decks and I wouldn't be able to pledge for this one either. So wait a little while and more people will have money to pledge!

Paul Carpenter · « **Reply #11 on:** November 27, 2011, 07:29:17 PM »

It will absolutely be a little while, certainly 2012 before I'm ready for everything. Along with the obvious time it takes to do a complete custom deck, I also have a 9-months pregnant wife and will have a new little boy in the next few weeks, so my card designs will happen in between everything else.

There have definitely been a TON of great decks coming out in rapid succession, so taking a little break would be to everyone's advantage I think.

I'm going to do it right, make sure all the details are spot on and won't be putting out anything subpar. I generally have pretty high standards for myself, and being my intro into the market I need to make sure it's the best possible work.

I'll be updating the site (http://encarded.com), Twitter (@encarded) and will be sure to let you guys know when I have something new to look at. Thanks for the support everyone, and I hope you guys like what I come up with.

Obviously, the Tendril deck you've seen in the design thread will be my first deck, but I'll be making changes and updates to what 's been posted already, so there will be some surprises in store.

phantom1412 · « **Reply #12 on:** November 27, 2011, 08:07:37 PM »

Interesting but I doubt that it would get a great success because it's really too much cards out there.

Don Boyer · « **Reply #13 on:** November 28, 2011, 02:02:45 AM »

@Xmetal - good luck, bro, on the deck and the baby!

dmbaggs · « **Reply #14 on:** November 28, 2011, 02:08:46 AM »

Very interesting! I thought it looked familiar. I'm excited to see what you come up with Xmetal. Best of luck to you!

Evan · « **Reply #15 on:** November 28, 2011, 02:39:17 PM »

New pic!

PoundFFFFFF · « **Reply #16 on:** November 28, 2011, 03:36:48 PM »

I personally think one-artist companies are a bad idea -_-

Wait & See, Wait & See.

Still, credits to xmetal for the extreme speed at which he set up a company, a website and a team. I'm astounded

Paul Carpenter · « **Reply #17 on:** November 28, 2011, 03:47:38 PM »

Well, if you sit around and wait for some other card designer to roll around, you probably won't get anything done. So guys like Alex and I jump in and go for it, and I think the results will be pretty darn decent and everyone benefits from more perspectives and ideas.

And really, even with a team of 3-4 it still takes a lot of time to design 50+ things, particularly custom art for court cards. No way to do that fast and make it right.

As to the speed with which I got rolling, it's easy! Make decision, add in 20 years experience, set aside 4 hours, and VIOLA! Logos, websites, prototypes. It's soooo easy. Really!

xela · « **Reply #18 on:** November 28, 2011, 04:14:17 PM »

Quote from: PoundFFFFFF on November 28, 2011, 03:36:48 PM

I personally think one-artist companies are a bad idea -_-

Wait & See, Wait & See.

Still, credits to xmetal for the extreme speed at which he set up a company, a website and a team. I'm astounded

Two-artist+ companies suffer from profit sharing issues. Why would I go through the hassle of figuring that stuff out when I could start things on my own? Plus, it's almost impossible to find an artist that is willing to put in hard work to get a job done. Most artists are very lazy, careless, and indifferent to money.

:-X

PoundFFFFFF · « **Reply #19 on:** November 28, 2011, 04:28:00 PM »

Quote

Two-artist+ companies suffer from profit sharing issues. Why would I go through the hassle of figuring that stuff out when I could start things on my own? Plus, it's almost impossible to find an artist that is willing to put in hard work to get a job done. Most artists are very lazy, careless, and indifferent to money.

:-X

Aha~ point taken.

Good artists are hard to find? I guess opportunities are abundant then

John B. · « **Reply #20 on:** November 28, 2011, 08:06:14 PM »

so with my company i help create the design and i have one artist to actually put it in action, might have to find someone to put it on computer but i know it will be a long haul, good luck encrded is all i have to say.

xela · « **Reply #21 on:** November 28, 2011, 09:48:34 PM »

Quote from: PoundFFFFFF on November 28, 2011, 04:28:00 PM

Quote

Two-artist+ companies suffer from profit sharing issues. Why would I go through the hassle of figuring that stuff out when I could start things on my own? Plus, it's almost impossible to find an artist that is willing to put in hard work to get a job done. Most artists are very lazy, careless, and indifferent to money.

:-X

Aha~ point taken.

Good artists are hard to find? I guess opportunities are abundant then

Good artists are easy to find. Good artists with drive, passion, and a need to put a high quality finished product above a paycheck is impossible. Most artists I know will happily do designing for a decent fee, but they won't put their heart into it.

Which is funny, because when I used to do freelance work, it was always a godsend to get clients who already knew the field and were willing to pay top dollar for high quality work.

Paul Carpenter · « **Reply #22 on:** December 02, 2011, 02:01:52 PM »

If you are interested, I've shared a little more info about Tendril and what I'm working on. Still all in progress but moving forward...

http://t.co/HCYmmEvz

AceGambit · « **Reply #23 on:** December 02, 2011, 03:01:36 PM »

Wow, I'm very impressed with what you've done so far. The deck is coming along beautifully. I'm not so much of a fan of the serif font for the indices though, I think I'd prefer it without them. Also I feel like the heart on the index should match the heart to the side of the king's head. It breaks consistency a little too much there.

Keep up the good work!

Paul Carpenter · « **Reply #24 on:** December 02, 2011, 03:31:26 PM »

Quote from: AceGambit on December 02, 2011, 03:01:36 PM

Also I feel like the heart on the index should match the heart to the side of the king's head.

Absolutely, and something I meant to do but overlooked. I corrected that and will keep playing with it. As to fonts, I looked through about 200 fonts and this one has a nice balance across all the needed items (numbers, A, K, Q, etc). I also liked that it has a little bit of serif which jives better with the "tendril" nature of the design.

Thanks for the comments and feedback though, I really want to put out something great.

PoundFFFFFF · « **Reply #25 on:** December 02, 2011, 03:47:18 PM »

I will have to be absolutely honest... for 20+ years of experience like you've been talking about I expected ALOT better..

There is no reason for ANY custom deck out there to not be on par with or exceed the quality of Ellusionist or T11's decks.

xela · « **Reply #26 on:** December 02, 2011, 03:55:12 PM »

Quote from: PoundFFFFFF on December 02, 2011, 03:47:18 PM

I will have to be absolutely honest... for 20+ years of experience like you've been talking about I expected ALOT better..

There is no reason for ANY custom deck out there to not be on par with or exceed the quality of Ellusionist or T11's decks.

Sure there is. The more you design decks, the more you learn about the design. You learn which colors their press can handle well and which colors look horrible. You learn that certain designs will look blurry due to the air-cushioning. You learn new techniques every week.

Aside from T11 which seems to be regressing with its designs from great to laughably horrible, if you take a look at E, you'll notice their style has improved greatly over the years. Compare the Ghosts and the Infinity decks - one clearly has the edge over the other.

Other companies also have teams of artists who, at the very least, help each other with critique. Paul's designs are actually pretty cool. His portfolio isn't too shabby and he clearly knows what he's doing.

Keep in mind you haven't seen his design at all yet. All you've seen is a quick concept of it.

PoundFFFFFF · « **Reply #27 on:** December 02, 2011, 04:27:33 PM »

Here's some constructive criticism - why not better?

PoundFFFFFF · « **Reply #28 on:** December 02, 2011, 04:37:51 PM »

Fine. I'll expand.

You've chosen to do custom court cards but unfortunately decided not to take it away from the original USPCC faces. Alex Chin has proven that he can completely shatter other decks in court card design - yet all other companies seem unwilling to leave the comfort of the original layout.

Even as, if you decide to improve the original layout, at least improve it. For now, at least, the crown and beard layout looks like a step down from the original.

You've chosen to use a gradient but instead applied it loosely and not very much to your benefit - masking it over the whole thing looks good on certain occasions - this isn't one of them.

In case this is a draft, then I shall take back the above, and I will wait to be astounded by the final product. Keep in mind that, according to your posts, you've been photoshopping before I was born. All I want is to start seeing great decks out.

Paul Carpenter · « **Reply #29 on:** December 02, 2011, 04:59:22 PM »

Well, a few comments:

- What you've seen is not final, but teasers, and I do appreciate the feedback as I continue to refine. I will warn that I'm not going to try to make Seasons v2 because that's not my concept.

- I've been designing various things for 20 years. That's true. I've been designing cards for, oh, 2 weeks. Not surprisingly, it's quite hard. Also not surprisingly, designing interactive media is not entirely translatable to playing card design. It's a tricky business, balancing detail with line weights, colors and alignments, mirroring and purposefully breaking the plane. Certainly a lot to learn, I'll be the first to admit.
- I see your illustrated suggestion, but to me that's not necessarily "better" (here's that whole sticky issue of design being subjective). The concept gradients I will agree are simple at the moment and might gain detail. A solid suggestion there and something to consider. I do have a clear concept for my deck, and part of that includes a homage to the original bicycle while adding my own touches. My concept doesn't include detail like Infinity, or illustration like Seasons. (both incredible decks, btw)

There's a wide variety of styles and approaches out there from the few that try to do something on their own. As an example, I personally don't like the Galvanic design. It's not something I will buy, but he's working hard on making something that he likes, which is awesome. I think its great that individuals or small teams even have the ability to produce something on their own these days.

xela · « **Reply #30 on:** December 02, 2011, 05:22:03 PM »

Paul I think your court cards could use some more depth and better highlights. I like the look of the cards, it's unique and a remake of something we know. Yes, #F, your suggested design is very nice, but is it better? Color-wise, yes. Shape wise? I can't decide, since both are different art styles.

It's like comparing painting with sculpting.

PoundFFFFFF · « **Reply #31 on:** December 02, 2011, 06:57:05 PM »

Oh dear, did I write "Better"? I meant to say "more effort". Sorry.

I still stand my case about not losIng to major card companies - what Alex said are technical issues one may run into whilst printing. They may have some better knowledge of the printing process but that is no excuse not to have stunning art. Saying that you have no experience designing cards is no excuse either. The Smoke and Mirros were a first for Si Scott. The Fantastiques were a visit for Sveta. So were the original Karnivals, Guardians, Fultons etc. They, like you, Spent a number of years in other fields of design before doing their first deck. With 20 years of experience you should already be Grand-Masterful.

Also, there is subjectivity in art but do not abuse the word. There is good design and there is bad design. If one does not understand that then he cannot be a designer.

Understand that I wholeheartedly want your company to succeed but this is your first deck - a reputation maker. Dont make the same mistake as bedeceived.

xela · « **Reply #32 on:** December 02, 2011, 08:29:41 PM »

Yep, I think #F is right here, but from the way Paul is working I can tell he's not about to pump out a deck this week and call it done.

Remember the original Vortex concepts from almost a year ago? Those things were god awful. I didn't even show you guys the original court cards or pip designs because they looked ridiculously amateur.

Right now, I want to focus on Paul's design in giving him helpful advice within his means. I personally believe that the court cards he has now can exude the feeling of effort if he added depth, highlights, and maybe some more color variation.

Sidenote: It's good to see so much constructive criticism here. I remember when I first put out my Vortex concept the responses almost never went beyond "AWESOME MUST BUY!!" or "Ew wtf." Use criticism and make your product awesome, Paul!

Paul Carpenter · « **Reply #33 on:** December 02, 2011, 08:35:28 PM »

Alex,

Spot on my man. Thanks for the forum to share this stuff.

#F,

I know your intentions are good and I do appreciate the feedback. You certainly do have a keen eye and I am thinking about the points you made and will no doubt work to further enhance my designs. You are 100% right that the intro to a market is critical.

A few things to consider (in a more general, life lessony kind of way):

- Asserting that a skilled pro in an area can seamlessly transition to another medium is, sorry to say, a bit unrealistic. Would you assume that a painter, Monet perhaps, could pick up a chisel and carve the statue of David on his first try? Or that Pavarotti could automatically write a symphony because he can sing? Sure, the core skills can translate through effort but the end goal is a very different place, with very different considerations. Manage your expectations and adjust criticism accordingly.

- Si Scott, for example, is a print designer and illustrator, a much closer analogue to card design than someone like me that has focused on designing GUIs, eLearning, websites and animation (and, secondly, his SM design is incredibly close to the bulk of his other work, so it wasn't much of a stretch).

- I'd encourage, even challenge you to step off the sidelines and give things a shot. You are obviously passionate, intelligent and naturally able to discern quality design. It is far too easy to stand on the sidelines and much harder to conceptualize and follow through. Certainly continue to critique, but sit down and put in the hours to make a complete project yourself. It quickly changes your perceptions (my appreciation for the decks sitting on my desk has increased 10-fold since I started my own project).

- And as an aside, I've rarely, in all the time I've been working been 100% pleased with my work. Even things that have been international award winning I look at and cringe at the raft of bad choices. But, that doesn't mean you stop and it doesn't mean your work isn't valuable. All it means is that you have more to learn

Cheers! Look for more from me soon.

PoundFFFFFF · « **Reply #34 on:** December 02, 2011, 08:42:03 PM »

Quote from: xmetal on December 02, 2011, 08:35:28 PM

- I'd encourage, even challenge you to step off the sidelines and give things a shot. You are obviously passionate, intelligent and naturally able to discern quality design. It is far too easy to stand on the sidelines and much harder to conceptualize and follow through. Certainly continue to critique, but sit down and put in the hours to make a complete project yourself. It quickly changes your perceptions (my appreciation for the decks sitting on my desk has increased 10-fold since I started my own project).

Wait & See, my friend

Paul Carpenter · « **Reply #35 on:** December 02, 2011, 09:24:43 PM »

Quote from: PoundFFFFFF on December 02, 2011, 08:42:03 PM

Wait & See, my friend

Excellent! Looking forward to it. There seems to be a lot of talent floating around here...

IAmTheChin · « **Reply #36 on:** December 07, 2011, 04:42:40 PM »

I love Si Scott. I creamed my pants when I found out him and D&D paired together to make a deck. I'm still looking for an original uncut sheet of one of the first 3 series. But I'd agree in that his skillset has a pretty strong overlap into the venn diagram of card design. I don't want to call him a one-trick pony, but xmetal is right in that his illustration style was fully established earlier that the crossover wasn't all that difficult.

My opinion? Play with the what you got. Be a purple cow. Do your hw and get some case studies under your belt. It's a new ball game and the clean graphics you apply to your websites don't necessarily translate to a deck of cards. Maybe it takes you longer, whatever. But if I were you I'd be designing the wazoo out of your website. Making it interactive like no ones business. You know how. You won a mother f*cking MAX award. Like woah. Make use of it. Find your hook and work it. Let your strengths hide your weaknesses until you get tone them up. It'll give you time to establish a strong customer base before launch.

-Chin

Lushbob · « **Reply #37 on:** December 07, 2011, 06:13:56 PM »

I'm just going to say that I love the way this deck is looking. I can't wait for the chance to place an order!

KPopFever605 · « **Reply #38 on:** December 07, 2011, 06:39:47 PM »

Ohh, I can't wait, I'm already loving the deck. When is the Kickstarter release date?

Lushbob · « **Reply #39 on:** December 07, 2011, 06:44:01 PM »

Quote from: KPopFever605 on December 07, 2011, 06:39:47 PM

Ohh, I can't wait, I'm already loving the deck. When is the Kickstarter release date?

I'd like to know that too!

Paul Carpenter · « **Reply #40 on:** December 07, 2011, 09:54:47 PM »

I don't have a kickstarter date at the moment. My goal is to make sure my design is solid and all the pieces are at least in the ballpark of final before I go to kickstarter. I also plan to make a video intro to put in there as well (using my snazzy canon T3i

) so there are some pieces to get in place. I just want it to be as excellent as I can so people can clearly see what they will be a part of.

In addition, a minor snag, if you will, is that my son was born a few days ago so I'm slightly preoccupied. Heh. I'm really excited about this project though and am putting in some time as the baby allows.

Stay tuned, and with the help of this awesome community we'll get something cool in the end.

dmbaggs · « **Reply #41 on:** December 08, 2011, 04:22:49 AM »

Congrats on the baby!!

I'm sure we are all willing to wait. Good work takes time and nobody likes a rushed deck, but we don't have to worry about that. The pictures I've seen are nice! I know that it's just a start and I can see the deck turning out fantastic. I'll definitely be keeping up to date on this one. Goodluck with everything and I can't wait to here more

KPopFever605 · « **Reply #42 on:** December 08, 2011, 11:06:30 AM »

Oh, Congratulations!

Just take your time, we are in no rush, we'll someone of us are (not me) as brown_baggs says, good work takes time.

Jin Jian · « **Reply #43 on:** December 08, 2011, 11:48:39 AM »

Quote from: xmetal on December 07, 2011, 09:54:47 PM

I don't have a kickstarter date at the moment. My goal is to make sure my design is solid and all the pieces are at least in the ballpark of final before I go to kickstarter. I also plan to make a video intro to put in there as well (using my snazzy canon T3i ) so there are some pieces to get in place. I just want it to be as excellent as I can so people can clearly see what they will be a part of.

In addition, a minor snag, if you will, is that my son was born a few days ago so I'm slightly preoccupied. Heh. I'm really excited about this project though and am putting in some time as the baby allows.

Stay tuned, and with the help of this awesome community we'll get something cool in the end.

gratz on the baby born.. wish that he grow up well

xela · « **Reply #44 on:** December 08, 2011, 01:52:47 PM »

Congratulations on the baby! He's lucky to grow up with such a talented father.

I am looking forward to more updates. If you need any advice on project launching feel free to contact me.

Paul Carpenter · « **Reply #45 on:** December 16, 2011, 10:14:56 PM »

As a quick note, you can now follow Encarded on Facebook, using the Like button at the bottom of the website or visiting http://facebook.com/encarded

Updates to the site will appear there, and as things progress we'll have some more fun stuff to share, contests, etc. Cheers!

Paul Carpenter · « **Reply #46 on:** December 21, 2011, 04:37:05 PM »

I've got a little Facebook contest going on. Just takes a quick Like, and you could win something special. Cheers!

http://encarded.com/post/14579596061/facebook-like-contest

Joshua Robinson · « **Reply #47 on:** December 31, 2011, 08:50:30 PM »

http://encarded.com/tendril

check it out

Lushbob · « **Reply #48 on:** December 31, 2011, 09:49:12 PM »

Quote from: Five on December 31, 2011, 08:50:30 PM

http://encarded.com/tendril

check it out

Just about to post about this.

Seriously, guys. This little teaser video makes me want the deck so much. So I guess, in that respect, it's done its job perfectly. The card backs look amazing, for a start. Not only that, but the face of the cards has a background aswell! And it looks great.
And don't get me started on the tuckbox. It's amazingly elegant, showing the four suits held up on tentacles, or tendrils, and reading tendril down the right side.
Don't take my word for it, check out the video yourself by clicking that link up there.
As soon as this deck goes on Kickstarter, you can be sure that I'll immediately be pledging for at least 3 of these decks.

moonexe · « **Reply #49 on:** December 31, 2011, 10:55:07 PM »

The box design looks beautiful! I can't wait to see the finished results, especially the court cards.

Paul Carpenter · « **Reply #50 on:** January 01, 2012, 06:20:04 PM »

I also posted a preview of the complete back design and each suit. Still working out a couple details but we are getting there. Just check the site.

Lushbob · « **Reply #51 on:** January 01, 2012, 06:41:48 PM »

Quote from: xmetal on January 01, 2012, 06:20:04 PM

I also posted a preview of the complete back design and each suit. Still working out a couple details but we are getting there. Just check the site.

Wow, they look amazing. I honestly can't wait to own one of these decks. Or three of them.

dee1orean · « **Reply #52 on:** January 01, 2012, 09:17:00 PM »

I'm liking this project, Paul, I think you have the patience of a saint. I'd have told #F where to go, I know he made some useful comments but some of his comments bordered on personal insults which is not on. But hey, we'll see what he's capable of if\when we see his project.

I've watched your trailer and am very impressed and excited to see this project develope.

In the trailer you mention 2000 decks on kickstarter, will the print run be bigger with decks available from your website? I hope so as you risk disappointing a lot of collectors who may want to add this deck to their collection.

Don Boyer · « **Reply #53 on:** January 01, 2012, 09:28:44 PM »

Quote from: dee1orean on January 01, 2012, 09:17:00 PM

In the trailer you mention 2000 decks on kickstarter, will the print run be bigger with decks available from your website? I hope so as you risk disappointing a lot of collectors who may want to add this deck to their collection.

...thus making them all the more sought after?

There's a reason why many decks are done in short print runs. These things COST MONEY, dude! Don't forget, as well - a larger deck project will trigger IRS withholding. If making a shorter run ensures that the deck has a greater chance of success, FANTASTIC, make the shorter run. It beats nothing getting made at all.

Paul Carpenter · « **Reply #54 on:** January 01, 2012, 09:42:03 PM »

I've thought about this a LOT, and I do mean a lot. Like, more than a lot. And in the end I decided that for my first project, my primary goal is to a.) make something pretty great b.) produce a number that allows me a high chance of success (so that I can move onto deck #2) and c.) keep the deck desirable so that in the future when Encarded is on deck 4 or 5 people look back and say "damn I wish I had one of those Tendril decks!"

My current plan is to produce 2500. I have to run my spreadsheets against all the various rewards and the final quote from USPCC, but if I can clear about half those via Kickstarter the project would be a success. I hope that Tendril will be good enough that I can beat the goal by a wide margin, which will make everything easier down the road. I'm planning on having a fair number of decks left over after the Kickstarter, which I can sell direct via my own website and use in contests and promotions.

I really have a vision for how all this could work down the road but want to ensure that #1 hits it right and is a success, setting up everything else. My head is already busting with deck #2 but I've got to get Tendril done right to make it all worthwhile.

Thanks to everyone for the kind words and supportive comments, this is a supremely fun and inspiring project and I really hope to be around for a while making awesome stuff.

loldudex2 · « **Reply #55 on:** January 01, 2012, 09:56:08 PM »

For your first backs, these look beautiful, and I can't wait to pick up a few if my wallet allows it.

Evan · « **Reply #56 on:** January 01, 2012, 11:45:45 PM »

These look incredible and there has clearly been a ton of work put into them.
But my one worry it that there is too much ink and that will make the cards not last long and just not be too good.

Paul Carpenter · « **Reply #57 on:** January 02, 2012, 01:54:50 AM »

Well any deck that USPCC makes starts with the same white papers, so my design would be no different from any other deck with close to full coverage inks, like any black deck currently out. I fully expect tendril to handle and last as well as any deck out, especially with the quality stock and magic finish we plan on using.

Evan · « **Reply #58 on:** January 02, 2012, 01:59:54 AM »

Quote from: xmetal on January 02, 2012, 01:54:50 AM

Well any deck that USPCC makes starts with the same white papers, so my design would be no different from any other deck with close to full coverage inks, like any black deck currently out. I fully expect tendril to handle and last as well as any deck out, especially with the quality stock and magic finish we plan on using.

What stock will you be using?

moonexe · « **Reply #59 on:** January 02, 2012, 04:26:44 AM »

I have noticed with my new shadow masters that the ink makes the deck slightly thicker and noticeably stiffer, which is something I don't especially enjoy. Others might not mind a stiffer deck, though, so that point is a matter of personal preference.

Either way, just like I wouldn't hesitate to buy shadow masters again because of how nice they look, I'll be sure to buy this deck regardless of the ink issues. Sometimes you gotta do some compromises.

Paul Carpenter · « **Reply #60 on:** January 02, 2012, 10:38:43 AM »

Quote from: MagicAddictz on January 02, 2012, 01:59:54 AM

What stock will you be using?

As of today, Aristocrat + Magic finish

Evan · « **Reply #61 on:** January 02, 2012, 12:08:21 PM »

Quote from: xmetal on January 02, 2012, 10:38:43 AM

Quote from: MagicAddictz on January 02, 2012, 01:59:54 AM
What stock will you be using?

As of today, Aristocrat + Magic finish

I don't think Aristocrat can handle that much ink. Its a soft stock to begin with and I just have a feeling it would break down very fast.

Paul Carpenter · « **Reply #62 on:** January 02, 2012, 01:41:15 PM »

Hmm, well I'll have to discuss that with USPCC. Thanks for the heads up.

Evan · « **Reply #63 on:** January 02, 2012, 02:07:02 PM »

Quote from: xmetal on January 02, 2012, 01:41:15 PM

Hmm, well I'll have to discuss that with USPCC. Thanks for the heads up.

Your welcome. I think maybe Bee Casino or Bike Casino would be better with that much ink

xela · « **Reply #64 on:** January 02, 2012, 11:14:09 PM »

Bike Casino no longer exists apparently

Robert Butler · « **Reply #65 on:** January 02, 2012, 11:18:17 PM »

Indeed MagicAddictz is very right, If you soak that much ink into a thin stock, the deck will wear down way too fast! I urge you against that.

moonexe · « **Reply #66 on:** January 02, 2012, 11:24:20 PM »

Quote from: alex. on January 02, 2012, 11:14:09 PM

Bike Casino no longer exists apparently

Isn't it what the new E decks(Artifice, Infinity and LTD) are printed on?

Robert Butler · « **Reply #67 on:** January 02, 2012, 11:27:30 PM »

no, those are on all bicycle casino

moonexe · « **Reply #68 on:** January 02, 2012, 11:33:49 PM »

Which is exactly what I said...

Don Boyer · « **Reply #69 on:** January 03, 2012, 05:34:51 AM »

Well, someone recently told me that Tally Ho decks have a variant of Aristocrat stock - with the move to Kentucky, they no longer have the old Tally Ho stock. I'd say the new Tallys are casino grade versions of the stock; it's hard to knock the quality, for one, and you know that new Tallys are much firmer than new Aristo reprints.

Paul Carpenter · « **Reply #70 on:** January 03, 2012, 09:11:59 AM »

My custom contact at USPCC offered Bicycle, Aristocrat and Bee (casino grade). Going with the Bee requires a larger run, and extra 4-6 delivery time as they outsource the tuck boxes. I get the feeling there are about a dozen "variants" of these stocks that mysteriously appear for certain clients and then go away...

Robert Butler · « **Reply #71 on:** January 03, 2012, 09:59:24 AM »

@Xmetal yep

The only difference in them tho are moisture content.

Don Boyer · « **Reply #72 on:** January 03, 2012, 10:01:13 AM »

Well, there's a number of factors that affect a stock. First of all, any stock isn't 100% consistent in quality to start with. Second, the black glue layer, in addition to the laminates and inks used in printing, affect the deck's performance. Even the temperature and humidity at which the stock is stored is a factor in the quality of the finished product. You could easily create custom variants of any card stock by tweaking these factors when producing your deck.

IAmTheChin · « **Reply #73 on:** January 06, 2012, 11:22:20 AM »

Complete side note here. Saw your promo video on 52 cartes. Really clean with a good pitch. Liked it a lot. Although admittedly "Symmetrical, yet not" sounded a bit silly in context lol.

Don Boyer · « **Reply #74 on:** January 06, 2012, 11:32:00 AM »

Quote from: xmetal on January 03, 2012, 09:11:59 AM

My custom contact at USPCC offered Bicycle, Aristocrat and Bee (casino grade). Going with the Bee requires a larger run, and extra 4-6 delivery time as they outsource the tuck boxes. I get the feeling there are about a dozen "variants" of these stocks that mysteriously appear for certain clients and then go away...

The Bee is one of their most popular stocks, with designers and casinos - could that also be a factor in the long wait time?

As far as stocks mysteriously appearing for some and not others, well - it's possible, but remember they don't actually make the paper. They deal with suppliers, the paper isn't always consistent, and occasionally certain grades may temporarily go out of stock for an indefinite time. They're slaves to the paper mills in that respect, unless they want to get into the paper business themselves - an unlikely possibility, since they likely rely on many different suppliers giving them papers made from wood from all around the country, if not the world.

Paul Carpenter · « **Reply #75 on:** January 06, 2012, 11:43:49 AM »

Quote from: IAmTheChin on January 06, 2012, 11:22:20 AM

Complete side note here. Saw your promo video on 52 cartes. Really clean with a good pitch. Liked it a lot. Although admittedly "Symmetrical, yet not" sounded a bit silly in context lol.

Thanks for the comments.

I admit that that one line is a little obtuse, but am just trying to differentiate what I am trying to do with the designs from all the plainly/obviously mirrored stuff you see in almost every card back out there. So, "Asymmetric Symmetry" was born.

Don Boyer · « **Reply #76 on:** January 06, 2012, 12:08:19 PM »

Quote from: xmetal on January 06, 2012, 11:43:49 AM

Quote from: IAmTheChin on January 06, 2012, 11:22:20 AM
Complete side note here. Saw your promo video on 52 cartes. Really clean with a good pitch. Liked it a lot. Although admittedly "Symmetrical, yet not" sounded a bit silly in context lol.

Thanks for the comments.

I admit that that one line is a little obtuse, but am just trying to differentiate what I am trying to do with the designs from all the plainly/obviously mirrored stuff you see in almost every card back out there. So, "Asymmetric Symmetry" was born.

How about "Subtle Symmetry"?

Masque · « **Reply #77 on:** January 06, 2012, 08:04:57 PM »

Perhaps "organic symmetry"?

Paul Carpenter · « **Reply #78 on:** January 07, 2012, 05:19:55 PM »

Two things: I like the "organic symmetry" line, Masque. I may just steal that.

Second, I have revised my opinion on stocks and based on expert feedback here as well as research, it does seem like Bee Casino would be the best choice for an end result that lasts and handles like I want it to. I'm not thrilled with the longer production times, but do want to end up with a superb product. This of course ties directly into how much funding is required via Kickstarter, so I hope my marketing efforts work well enough that we can cover the costs and make it happen.

Don Boyer · « **Reply #79 on:** January 08, 2012, 12:45:03 AM »

Quote from: xmetal on January 07, 2012, 05:19:55 PM

Two things: I like the "organic symmetry" line, Masque. I may just steal that.
Second, I have revised my opinion on stocks and based on expert feedback here as well as research, it does seem like Bee Casino would be the best choice for an end result that lasts and handles like I want it to. I'm not thrilled with the longer production times, but do want to end up with a superb product. This of course ties directly into how much funding is required via Kickstarter, so I hope my marketing efforts work well enough that we can cover the costs and make it happen.

To insure success, why not make it a stretch goal, like what Alex did for metallic inks and other features? You have a lower bar to cross in order to get the deck off your hard drive and on the presses, but can still shoot for getting the better stock. And if you can't hit the mark for the stretch goal, Aristo stock isn't exactly shabby. Ask for the stock they're using on the new Tally Ho decks - THAT they MUST have in stock! Another stretch goal might be to get the decks traditionally cut like the Tallys.

moonexe · « **Reply #80 on:** January 31, 2012, 04:19:21 PM »

I just saw the prototype pictures on facebook - They look AMAZING!

http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.322929004396799.74578.308073555882344&type=1

http://a4.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/421284_339393846083648_308073555882344_1087237_797860123_n.jpg

http://a3.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/420503_339393872750312_308073555882344_1087238_1760574821_n.jpg

http://a5.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/418879_339393886083644_308073555882344_1087239_1712453655_n.jpg

http://a4.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/403350_339393979416968_308073555882344_1087242_1409798656_n.jpg

Just thought I would share for those who aren't subscribed.
The box alone puts T11 to shame, and does so in simplicity, without all the gimmicks!

Paul Carpenter · « **Reply #81 on:** January 31, 2012, 04:22:50 PM »

Thanks Moon, I didn't get a chance to comment in here before you beat me to it.

Here's the page on my site: http://encarded.com/post/16821583823/the-tendril-protodeck-is-here-and-looks-pretty

Evan · « **Reply #82 on:** January 31, 2012, 05:41:40 PM »

Those look awesome! I love the court cards and the colors you used!
I wasn't expecting the white border on the front but I see why you did that and it looks awesome!
Is that a prototype deck?

Paul Carpenter · « **Reply #83 on:** January 31, 2012, 06:07:05 PM »

Yes, I wanted to explore a new idea and do a front/back bordered deck to keep it "black" but eliminate the whole edge chipping issue which drives me nuts. Looks very different in hand, totally new compared to any other deck I own. I suspect some folks will be rather shocked by it, but you can't argue with trying new things.

And yes, that is a prototype. Printed out on the bee casino stock on a "normal" printer, air cushioned and magic finished and then stripped and cut by hand, from what they tell me. it looks and feels exactly like any other quality deck I own. After the photography and video is done I'll be signing that and putting it up on the wall.

And remember somebody will get the double backer if we reach our social goals...

Don Boyer · « **Reply #84 on:** February 01, 2012, 12:11:35 AM »

That's one of the thinnest borders I've ever seen - effective yet practically unobtrusive. I think you and USPC knocked it out of the park on this one. But you need TIGHT quality control when this hits mass production to insure centered cards and even borders all around.

I'm really, REALLY looking forward to owning this deck.

dee1orean · « **Reply #85 on:** February 01, 2012, 02:29:25 AM »

Ohhh boy!.... I've never seen a deck even come close to this, just stunning, it's not often I buy bricks or uncuts... Think I'll start putting money away now LOL!

dmbaggs · « **Reply #86 on:** February 01, 2012, 03:15:54 AM »

After looking over those pictures I'm liking this deck more and more!! The borders look great on the back

The box also looks really nice. I'm looking forward to seeing even more pictures!

Evan · « **Reply #87 on:** February 01, 2012, 08:24:26 AM »

Is the border thinner than a standard bike deck? It looks thinner but IMO thats a good thing... A thick border on this deck wouldnt look as good

Paul Carpenter · « **Reply #88 on:** February 01, 2012, 09:17:00 AM »

I think I pushed USPCC as far as they would go. I initially had a border area about half that of what you see in those pictures, but they requested that I "meet them halfway" and increase the border size. I think it's still pretty thin compared to what I see around, and having the dramatic black->shadow->light gray transition makes it look pretty wild compared with what you normally see.

Paul Carpenter · « **Reply #89 on:** February 01, 2012, 10:01:02 AM »

Quote from: Good@Sabacc on February 01, 2012, 12:11:35 AM

That's one of the thinnest borders I've ever seen - effective yet practically unobtrusive. I think you and USPC knocked it out of the park on this one. But you need TIGHT quality control when this hits mass production to insure centered cards and even borders all around.

I'm really, REALLY looking forward to owning this deck.

That really means a lot to me, coming from such a knowledgable collector. Thanks. And yes, USPCC is going to have to be on the ball big time with this deck, but I think they will get it done nicely. They seemed very excited about the deck and told me as much so maybe they'll give it a little extra love.

NathanCanadas · « **Reply #90 on:** February 01, 2012, 12:08:46 PM »

It looks amazing, although I do own a couple decks with white borders the same size. I might put pictures up. Good luck!

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