You are Here:
Anti-KS : Encarded Zenith

Author (Read 60401 times)

Re: Anti-KS : Encarded Zenith
« Reply #25 on: January 23, 2014, 06:30:42 PM »
 

Don Boyer

  • VP/Dir. Club Forum/DAC Chair, 52 Plus Joker
  • Administrator
  • Forum Sentinel
  • *
  • 19,161
    Posts
  • Reputation: 415
  • Pick a card, any card...no, not THAT card!

  • Facebook:
That pretty much hits the nail on the head.  EPCC will work with more than one printer - basically, whoever can make the best cards at the right price point.  I'm assuming that this will be made with the Taiwan printer used for Exquisite, Legend, etc.
Card Illusionist, NYC Area
Playing Card Design & Development Consultant
Deck Tailoring: Custom Alterations for Magicians and Card Mechanics
Services for Hire - http://thedecktailor.com/
Pre-Made Decks for Sale - http://donboyermagic.com/
 

Re: Anti-KS : Encarded Zenith
« Reply #26 on: January 23, 2014, 07:04:05 PM »
 

Paul Carpenter

  • 52 Plus Joker Member
  • Extraordinaire
  • *
  • 1,071
    Posts
  • Reputation: 74
  • Encarded makes custom playing cards.

  • Facebook:

  • Kickstarter:

  • Twitter:

  • YouTube:
Yes, I'll be using the Exquisite printer, which is more used to doing the "high end" decks with all the fancy features.
Paul Carpenter
Designer - http://encarded.com

Tendril Ascendant & Nightfall  /  Standards /  Chancellor, Zenith, Deco, Aurum, Tendril: Sold Out
 

Re: Anti-KS : Encarded Zenith
« Reply #27 on: January 23, 2014, 07:12:08 PM »
 

MrMollusk

  • Extraordinaire
  • *
  • 975
    Posts
  • Reputation: 23
  • I like birds.

  • Kickstarter:
It looks awesome so far!

I can't wait for them to come out. It's also great to see you working on your own signature series!
( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
 

Re: Anti-KS : Encarded Zenith
« Reply #28 on: January 23, 2014, 08:20:02 PM »
 

MagikFingerz

  • Forum Regular
  • *
  • 109
    Posts
  • Reputation: 18
I'm actually not a huge fan of the way EPCC decks handle. They're certainly not bad, but in general I think USPCC decks handle better (comparing custom USPCC decks to the Legends and Exquisites). Maybe I'm just more used to them, who knows. Either way I'm a huge fan of everything Encarded puts out so I can't wait for these.

Everyone is of course entitled to their opinion, but the difference between the Global Titans and Exquisite (for me) is massive. I'm not a magician personally, just a collector - but the latter felt absolutely amazing and I can see why it's getting rave reviews.

Looking forward to this Paul.

I have to agree with you, Paul. As a cardist the Exquisites outshine the Global Titans by quite a bit, even the Legends doesn't feel as "right" as the Exquisites do IMO.
- Tom
 

Re: Anti-KS : Encarded Zenith
« Reply #29 on: January 23, 2014, 08:29:32 PM »
 

Card Player

  • Extraordinaire
  • *
  • 1,054
    Posts
  • Reputation: 28
Yes, I'll be using the Exquisite printer, which is more used to doing the "high end" decks with all the fancy features.

Very Nice!

The way it sounded, EPCC was doing their own printing & manufacturing. So, EPCC is more of a middle man producer or gatekeeper to the Taiwanese printer?
 

Re: Anti-KS : Encarded Zenith
« Reply #30 on: January 23, 2014, 09:07:13 PM »
 

52plusjoker

  • Frequent Flyer
  • *
  • 887
    Posts
  • Reputation: 49
Paul - I like what I've seen here!
Will be edging around to your site to get in the order book.
Cheers
Tom Dawson
52 Plus Joker Playing Card Collectors Club
 

Re: Anti-KS : Encarded Zenith
« Reply #31 on: January 23, 2014, 09:57:00 PM »
 

Paul Carpenter

  • 52 Plus Joker Member
  • Extraordinaire
  • *
  • 1,071
    Posts
  • Reputation: 74
  • Encarded makes custom playing cards.

  • Facebook:

  • Kickstarter:

  • Twitter:

  • YouTube:
Bill Kalush, from CARC, has made all the contacts, done all the research, conducted experiments and slogged through the leg work to find and collaborate with the printers overseas, and is the conduit through which folks like me can print. He set up EPCC to be the channel through which people outside of CARC projects can utilize the resources he's put together.

I had great conversations with him in Vegas last year, was really excited by what I saw and my project just happened to time out as the first external project to get into the pipeline. I'm sure you'll be seeing more in the future. :)
Paul Carpenter
Designer - http://encarded.com

Tendril Ascendant & Nightfall  /  Standards /  Chancellor, Zenith, Deco, Aurum, Tendril: Sold Out
 

Re: Anti-KS : Encarded Zenith
« Reply #32 on: January 23, 2014, 10:23:36 PM »
 

Justin O.

  • 52 Plus Joker Member
  • Discourse Deity
  • *
  • 636
    Posts
  • Reputation: 8
  • Charm gets you quite far. Guile gets you the rest.
Bill Kalush, from CARC, has made all the contacts, done all the research, conducted experiments and slogged through the leg work to find and collaborate with the printers overseas, and is the conduit through which folks like me can print. He set up EPCC to be the channel through which people outside of CARC projects can utilize the resources he's put together.

If you work with Bill through EPCC do you have to sell through CARC?
Kickstarter completely revolutionized the way I waste money.

The people who handle playing cards are always in a world of delicate fingertip technology.
 

Re: Anti-KS : Encarded Zenith
« Reply #33 on: January 23, 2014, 11:01:53 PM »
 

jmrock

  • 52 Plus Joker Member
  • Discourse Deity
  • *
  • 650
    Posts
  • Reputation: 29
Imagine, a deck release that DOESN'T USE KICKSTARTER! The horror!  The insanity!  :P

The horror for me is not that you're moving forward without kickstarter… I actually rather like that… The horror for me is that you're moving forward without USPCC… I know that some designers and/or companies are using printers overseas and I fully understand that USPCC is not the only printer in the world… However, I do have such a strong attachment to USPCC and have sold off much of my collection that isn't printed with USPCC excluding companies which merged early on… i.e.; Russell Morgan, Consolidated, etc…  That being said, Paul, I've been a fan since day one and it's looking really nice, from what little I can see from the pics… I also like the ltd. print run… Given all the business you've done with USPCC, are they still not open to printing a smaller run, or is it they can no longer accomplish the things that you need done for this deck? I don't know, there seems to be a continuity for me when a designer uses the same printer and what can I say, I like that there is such a rich history involving the USPCC, given they originated in the United States, and that they started over a century ago quickly to become the greatest force in the world when it comes to quality and still today, they maintain their place as the leading playing card company in the world… There is something very moving about their heritage combined with a striking design that is a winning combination for me, unlike flipping over the box to read, "Made in China…"  I do however, wish you the best of luck in producing another great deck and if I am able to break from tradition, I am wondering how one could acquire the deck?  Did I miss this?  Let's see some more pics as well…
 

Re: Anti-KS : Encarded Zenith
« Reply #34 on: January 24, 2014, 06:49:00 AM »
 

MagikFingerz

  • Forum Regular
  • *
  • 109
    Posts
  • Reputation: 18
Bill Kalush, from CARC, has made all the contacts, done all the research, conducted experiments and slogged through the leg work to find and collaborate with the printers overseas, and is the conduit through which folks like me can print. He set up EPCC to be the channel through which people outside of CARC projects can utilize the resources he's put together.

If you work with Bill through EPCC do you have to sell through CARC?

He said earlier in the thread that he will sell them through his own website.
- Tom
 

Re: Anti-KS : Encarded Zenith
« Reply #35 on: January 24, 2014, 10:21:44 AM »
 

Paul Carpenter

  • 52 Plus Joker Member
  • Extraordinaire
  • *
  • 1,071
    Posts
  • Reputation: 74
  • Encarded makes custom playing cards.

  • Facebook:

  • Kickstarter:

  • Twitter:

  • YouTube:
Imagine, a deck release that DOESN'T USE KICKSTARTER! The horror!  The insanity!  :P

The horror for me is not that you're moving forward without kickstarter… I actually rather like that… The horror for me is that you're moving forward without USPCC… I know that some designers and/or companies are using printers overseas and I fully understand that USPCC is not the only printer in the world… However, I do have such a strong attachment to USPCC and have sold off much of my collection that isn't printed with USPCC excluding companies which merged early on… i.e.; Russell Morgan, Consolidated, etc…  That being said, Paul, I've been a fan since day one and it's looking really nice, from what little I can see from the pics… I also like the ltd. print run… Given all the business you've done with USPCC, are they still not open to printing a smaller run, or is it they can no longer accomplish the things that you need done for this deck? I don't know, there seems to be a continuity for me when a designer uses the same printer and what can I say, I like that there is such a rich history involving the USPCC, given they originated in the United States, and that they started over a century ago quickly to become the greatest force in the world when it comes to quality and still today, they maintain their place as the leading playing card company in the world… There is something very moving about their heritage combined with a striking design that is a winning combination for me, unlike flipping over the box to read, "Made in China…"  I do however, wish you the best of luck in producing another great deck and if I am able to break from tradition, I am wondering how one could acquire the deck?  Did I miss this?  Let's see some more pics as well…

Everyone has an attachment to USPCC. They produce very good cards, been around forever, everyone knows them. Their history is undeniable. They have done great work for me, and will continue to do so, no doubt. The cards they have printed for me are excellent.

However, I don't think there is anything wrong with some competition. When you bring things to USPCC, you generally are told what reality is, as opposed to discussing it. It's not really negotiating, or working together, more of a, "You want that? Fine, you will pay what we say." and you don't have much information or input on why things are the way they are. Being the only game in town does have byproducts, some of which aren't always desirable. That model continues to work because so many people are new and simply want the cards made by them, regardless of whether it makes sense for their particular needs.

I'm sure they could print just 1,000 decks for me. However, it would cost considerably more. I might have to pay for a full run of 2,500 decks anyways. If I wanted Bee Casino, I might have to print 5,000 just to get the 1,000 I want to sell. Consider that even Jackson, who printed like 22,000 decks in one run had to beg and plead to get his black deck done, and boy did he pay for it.

Zenith will not be a $5 cheap deck, because it's full featured and a very small run, but with EPCC, I can bring a top-notch deck to market for a reasonable price that collectors won't feel is from crazytown, even though only 1,000 exist. They will handle great, look great, have everything people expect and be done at a cost that makes projects like this easily doable. No need to sweat and try to raise funds on Kickstarter and hope and pray it all works out. I can design something that excites me, pay for it and sell it as I please. I like that aspect a lot, since it feels like actual grown up business. :)
Paul Carpenter
Designer - http://encarded.com

Tendril Ascendant & Nightfall  /  Standards /  Chancellor, Zenith, Deco, Aurum, Tendril: Sold Out
 

Re: Anti-KS : Encarded Zenith
« Reply #36 on: January 24, 2014, 11:28:48 AM »
 

Rob Wright

  • 52 Plus Joker Member
  • Aficionado
  • *
  • 1,363
    Posts
  • Reputation: 98

  • Kickstarter:
I agree that USPCC needs a big competitor. I just wish there was a US printer that could do it. Paul good luck with your project. I'm in for a few.
Last night I stayed up late playing poker with Tarot cards. I got a full house and four people died.

 Steven Wright
http://neverforgotten.storenvy.com
Facebook- Never Forgotten Project

My Playing Card DB
 

Re: Anti-KS : Encarded Zenith
« Reply #37 on: January 25, 2014, 02:56:55 AM »
 

Don Boyer

  • VP/Dir. Club Forum/DAC Chair, 52 Plus Joker
  • Administrator
  • Forum Sentinel
  • *
  • 19,161
    Posts
  • Reputation: 415
  • Pick a card, any card...no, not THAT card!

  • Facebook:

I have to agree with you, Paul. As a cardist the Exquisites outshine the Global Titans by quite a bit, even the Legends doesn't feel as "right" as the Exquisites do IMO.

Bill Kalush personally had the process of making the Exquisites at the Taiwan plant altered, while Lawrence Sullivan went with the plant's standard print methods.  Bill himself has been commenting on how his Exquisites are just a little better than the Legends, and that's why.

He used to do this with USPC - while trying to perfect the process of making a pack of cards with the best performance, he would specify certain changes to the print process and place an order for himself, usually a stock deck like Bicycle or Bee but with his custom methods applied.  As he got the cards back, he saw what performance differences the changes made and did the same process all over again, refining and improving the process.  This takes a LOT of resources to accomplish, more than most designers would ever have access to without a wealthy relative passing away and leaving him or her the estate.

Remember his Bee Erdnase 216s?  Some didn't like the design of the back, but none who've tried them can deny the quality of the cards and how well they handled - some such as myself stated that it was unlike anything I've ever seen come out of USPC in my card-playing lifetime.  That deck's quality was about 85% as good as the Exquisites - he used the knowledge accumulated from all those test runs to make the card-making process as close to perfect as he could.

Paul: excellent points about why to not always use USPC.  Many designers have felt frustrated with USPC's custom deck process and wanted something less restrictive and more controllable.  The plants that Bill use are indeed capable of quality output in shorter-than-USPC-minimum runs - in some cases, of a quality that exceeds most USPC-made decks - with at least some savings over what USPC charges.

I agree that USPCC needs a big competitor. I just wish there was a US printer that could do it. Paul good luck with your project. I'm in for a few.

While computers and design software have made the design process much more democratic in that nearly anyone can afford a computer and a design program, this is not the case for the processes required to make that design into an actual deck of cards.  There have been many improvements, to be sure, but the basic process itself of creating the pasteboard (or purchasing it from someone else who made it) and getting the ink on the paper with printing plates is still very much the same as it's been for well over a century.  It's not the kind of hardware that most people can afford and it's way too large to use it in all but the largest of home shops/work areas.

Even if you could afford the hardware, you then need to provide the raw goods (paper, ink, tools and supplies for maintenance) and the talent to keep that press operating and to somehow eke a profit out of it.  USPC has the major advantage of having a handful of common brands that people buy all over the country and in many parts of the rest of the world combined with close to 130 years of experience making playing cards, providing them a steady source of income - Joe Sixpack doesn't have that at all, and has to start literally from scratch, with no income from volume work like the Bicycle Rider Back or the Bee Diamond Back to help sustain operations while you tackle boutique print jobs for clients wanting short print runs.

It's like you're always just a few slow days away from running out of cash and folding.  The Internet helps in that you can attract clients and work from practically anywhere in the world, but you're still shouting to be heard over the voice of the 800-pound gorilla in the room that is USPC.

Given enough time, however, we could reach a point where, just like computers, the hardware will shrink in size from something that could fill a warehouse to small enough to fit in a single room with space to spare - though it will never, at least in my lifetime, go portable and pocket-sized, due to the nature of what you're trying to make.

Plants overseas have a better shot at being able to do what I described above because they have one thing that USPC doesn't - labor laws that favor the manufacturer and result in a greatly-reduced cost of labor.  If you compared apples to apples, making an Asian factory outside of Japan or South Korea that's identically equipped to what USPC has in Erlanger, their lower labor costs will always give them the edge.

You might have been able to argue at one time in history (and not all that long ago) that USPC's quality made them stand out above the others, but that's no longer the case, due to a) the foreign printers getting better at what they do and b) USPC being a bit less attentive to the work they're doing, resulting in needless, costly mistakes.  If you run a deck design company and have made three or more decks with USPC, odds are strongly in favor of you having a horror story about something going wrong with USPC on at least one of your print jobs.
Card Illusionist, NYC Area
Playing Card Design & Development Consultant
Deck Tailoring: Custom Alterations for Magicians and Card Mechanics
Services for Hire - http://thedecktailor.com/
Pre-Made Decks for Sale - http://donboyermagic.com/
 

Re: Anti-KS : Encarded Zenith
« Reply #38 on: January 25, 2014, 08:52:09 AM »
 

Rob Wright

  • 52 Plus Joker Member
  • Aficionado
  • *
  • 1,363
    Posts
  • Reputation: 98

  • Kickstarter:
For me, if I ever can get my deck designed. I will use USPC for the first one. The company may be foreign owned, and may be using non-domestic materials. But it is American workers, truckers, etc.

Having said that. I have no problem with Paul, and other designers doing this. Hopefully it will wake up the 800 pound gorilla. Before reading this thread, I didn't know that EPCC was offering this type of service. It could be great for a lot of designers. I'm positive it won't be an issue, but I hope Bill is very selective of what passes through his company. Unlike USPC that will alow people to put Bicycle on a turd and call them playing cards.
Last night I stayed up late playing poker with Tarot cards. I got a full house and four people died.

 Steven Wright
http://neverforgotten.storenvy.com
Facebook- Never Forgotten Project

My Playing Card DB
 

Re: Anti-KS : Encarded Zenith
« Reply #39 on: January 25, 2014, 09:51:10 AM »
 

52plusjoker

  • Frequent Flyer
  • *
  • 887
    Posts
  • Reputation: 49
USPC is owned by Jarden Corp. which is headquartered in Rye, NY and listed on the New York Stock Exchange. Jarden has 30-40 brands, many of which are quite American - e.g. Sunbeam, Coleman, etc.
Tom Dawson
52 Plus Joker Playing Card Collectors Club
 

Re: Anti-KS : Encarded Zenith
« Reply #40 on: January 26, 2014, 01:34:42 AM »
 

Don Boyer

  • VP/Dir. Club Forum/DAC Chair, 52 Plus Joker
  • Administrator
  • Forum Sentinel
  • *
  • 19,161
    Posts
  • Reputation: 415
  • Pick a card, any card...no, not THAT card!

  • Facebook:
Yeah, Rob - USPC/Jarden are about as American as a company gets, aside from having a few overseas holdings.  For example, USPC holds Heraclio Fournier in Spain, and I'd be shocked if the parent company, Jarden, didn't have other overseas holdings.  But boil it down to brass tacks and they're an American company.
Card Illusionist, NYC Area
Playing Card Design & Development Consultant
Deck Tailoring: Custom Alterations for Magicians and Card Mechanics
Services for Hire - http://thedecktailor.com/
Pre-Made Decks for Sale - http://donboyermagic.com/
 

Re: Anti-KS : Encarded Zenith
« Reply #41 on: January 26, 2014, 11:54:43 AM »
 

HolyJJ

  • Discourse Royalty
  • *
  • 354
    Posts
  • Reputation: 18
This is brilliant!

In simple terms, my two favourites are coming together -- favourite designer (Encarded), and favourite for card quality (CARC/EPCC)!

The output from the Taiwan factor y has really impressed me... and the feel of the Exquisite cards have been the best of the lot! Combine the second-to-none feel of the Exquisites with a BORDERLESS design with a luxury look, and a low print run... man, this one is going to be a winner for both collectors and card users!

Paul, I have a question for you brother... you've hinted that the cards will have the same stock and finish as the Exquisite cards, but will they also be cut exactly the same way??

The reason I ask is because until now, all of your decks which were printed at the USPCC were cut in the standard way, whereby the blade enters the sheet through the face (rather than having what Richard Turner coined a 'traditional cut').

Although Bill Kalush has said that the cards at the Taiwan factory have a cut which negates the need to even consider traditional or non-traditional, I actually find that they handle the way to be traditionally cut decks do -- they table faro (with a bottom-up weave) much better when the cards are face down.

When I first asked Lawrance about how the Legends were cut, he said that they are traditionally cut, but using a different cutting method. That sounds right to be.

Anyway, I'm really looking forward to this one -- a borderless deck from the Taiwan factory was pretty much at the top of my wants list for 2014!

Nothing at all against the USPCC... but their magic finish is really not my cup of tea, and their off-centre cutting is disappointing. Well done Paul, for taking the Zennith deck over to the Taiwan printers... because your high quality designs deserve to be printed with only the highest quality card stock and coating :D
With this signature I'm following the example set by Fes: There is only ONE letter L in my display name. "Holly" is a female name... and I'm a bearded guy who's into weightlifting. There's nothing feminine about me brother!
 

Re: Anti-KS : Encarded Zenith
« Reply #42 on: January 26, 2014, 05:45:20 PM »
 

Paul Carpenter

  • 52 Plus Joker Member
  • Extraordinaire
  • *
  • 1,071
    Posts
  • Reputation: 74
  • Encarded makes custom playing cards.

  • Facebook:

  • Kickstarter:

  • Twitter:

  • YouTube:
HolyJJ, thanks for the kind words. :)

I have talked with Bill Kalush and basically instructed him that I want Zenith exactly the same as the Exquisites. I've been very happy with their long term handling and I want my deck the same.  So if you like the Exquisite, you should be pleased.
Paul Carpenter
Designer - http://encarded.com

Tendril Ascendant & Nightfall  /  Standards /  Chancellor, Zenith, Deco, Aurum, Tendril: Sold Out
 

Re: Anti-KS : Encarded Zenith
« Reply #43 on: January 27, 2014, 12:46:02 AM »
 

Rob Wright

  • 52 Plus Joker Member
  • Aficionado
  • *
  • 1,363
    Posts
  • Reputation: 98

  • Kickstarter:
Yeah, Rob - USPC/Jarden are about as American as a company gets, aside from having a few overseas holdings.  For example, USPC holds Heraclio Fournier in Spain, and I'd be shocked if the parent company, Jarden, didn't have other overseas holdings.  But boil it down to brass tacks and they're an American company.

Sorry to sound like a dummy. I should have worded what I said differently-" don't know if USPC is a US company or not, but they are putting Americans to work." 
Last night I stayed up late playing poker with Tarot cards. I got a full house and four people died.

 Steven Wright
http://neverforgotten.storenvy.com
Facebook- Never Forgotten Project

My Playing Card DB
 

Re: Anti-KS : Encarded Zenith
« Reply #44 on: January 27, 2014, 02:08:23 AM »
 

Don Boyer

  • VP/Dir. Club Forum/DAC Chair, 52 Plus Joker
  • Administrator
  • Forum Sentinel
  • *
  • 19,161
    Posts
  • Reputation: 415
  • Pick a card, any card...no, not THAT card!

  • Facebook:
Yeah, Rob - USPC/Jarden are about as American as a company gets, aside from having a few overseas holdings.  For example, USPC holds Heraclio Fournier in Spain, and I'd be shocked if the parent company, Jarden, didn't have other overseas holdings.  But boil it down to brass tacks and they're an American company.

Sorry to sound like a dummy. I should have worded what I said differently-" don't know if USPC is a US company or not, but they are putting Americans to work."

Hey, don't sweat it.  It's cool, and now you learned something you didn't know before.


The reason I ask is because until now, all of your decks which were printed at the USPCC were cut in the standard way, whereby the blade enters the sheet through the face (rather than having what Richard Turner coined a 'traditional cut').

Actually, the "face down" cut is the traditional cut, while the "face up" cut is the modern cut.  Here's an excerpt from the Penguin Magic page selling Richard Turner's Gold Seal Bicycles:

Unlike most of the cards manufactured today, the cutting blade used in traditionally cut cards starts at the face of each card and punches through to its back. As a result, a sharp edge is created on the backside of each card and a rounded edge, which facilitates a flawless weave during each shuffle, is formed on the card's face.

Traditionally cut cards ensure that card men and magicians can easily interlace the cards to produce crisp, clean shuffles, especially with some of the more intricate shuffling techniques like the one-handed shuffle, and the faro shuffle, both in-hand, and on the table.


http://www.penguinmagic.com/p/S11123

The difference in the cut is that it creates a beveled edge favoring a face-down faro shuffling right out of the box, whereas modern cut requires you have the cards face up when table faro shuffling.  Some even say that the bevel of the face-down cut gives better control when performing the more basic riffle shuffle as well.

Bill Kalush mentioned when I saw him last that his decks from the "Exquisite" factory are cut in a way that is neither traditional or modern - the bevel's edge is more centered, allowing for easy table faro shuffles either face up or face down when fresh out of the box.  I've read online somewhere that Fournier 605s are cut in the same way.
Card Illusionist, NYC Area
Playing Card Design & Development Consultant
Deck Tailoring: Custom Alterations for Magicians and Card Mechanics
Services for Hire - http://thedecktailor.com/
Pre-Made Decks for Sale - http://donboyermagic.com/
 

Re: Anti-KS : Encarded Zenith
« Reply #45 on: January 27, 2014, 03:15:24 AM »
 

HolyJJ

  • Discourse Royalty
  • *
  • 354
    Posts
  • Reputation: 18
Paul, thanks for answering my question -- man, I'm DELIGHTED to hear that the Zenith cards will handle exactly the same way as the Exquisites! That's music to my ears! I'll be hoping to buy 3 bricks on the day they release :D

Don, in my post I was trying to say that Paul's cards till now have NOT had a traditional cut (hence the words "rather than")... and so we're basically saying the same thing brother (I didn't mention anything about the sheet being face up or face down). I'm also aware of the misconception that quite a lot of people have whereby they think that the blade comes down from above and guillotines the sheet!

I did read on the sales page for the Exquisites that they are cut neither traditionally, or are they cut the modern way... however, I've probably done about 500 hundred tabled faros with each Exquisite deck that I have, and I've only been able do them when the cards are face down. Either I've received decks which weren't cut right, or they really do perform better face down.

I recommend putting them to the test.
« Last Edit: January 27, 2014, 03:19:34 AM by HolyJJ »
With this signature I'm following the example set by Fes: There is only ONE letter L in my display name. "Holly" is a female name... and I'm a bearded guy who's into weightlifting. There's nothing feminine about me brother!
 

Re: Anti-KS : Encarded Zenith
« Reply #46 on: January 27, 2014, 05:06:58 AM »
 

Don Boyer

  • VP/Dir. Club Forum/DAC Chair, 52 Plus Joker
  • Administrator
  • Forum Sentinel
  • *
  • 19,161
    Posts
  • Reputation: 415
  • Pick a card, any card...no, not THAT card!

  • Facebook:
Paul, thanks for answering my question -- man, I'm DELIGHTED to hear that the Zenith cards will handle exactly the same way as the Exquisites! That's music to my ears! I'll be hoping to buy 3 bricks on the day they release :D

Don, in my post I was trying to say that Paul's cards till now have NOT had a traditional cut (hence the words "rather than")... and so we're basically saying the same thing brother (I didn't mention anything about the sheet being face up or face down). I'm also aware of the misconception that quite a lot of people have whereby they think that the blade comes down from above and guillotines the sheet!

I did read on the sales page for the Exquisites that they are cut neither traditionally, or are they cut the modern way... however, I've probably done about 500 hundred tabled faros with each Exquisite deck that I have, and I've only been able do them when the cards are face down. Either I've received decks which weren't cut right, or they really do perform better face down.

I recommend putting them to the test.

Believe me, I have been!  It's a great deck.  He gave me a few last time I visited his office, a few days before the release.
Card Illusionist, NYC Area
Playing Card Design & Development Consultant
Deck Tailoring: Custom Alterations for Magicians and Card Mechanics
Services for Hire - http://thedecktailor.com/
Pre-Made Decks for Sale - http://donboyermagic.com/
 

Re: Anti-KS : Encarded Zenith
« Reply #47 on: March 07, 2014, 10:18:14 PM »
 

Paul Carpenter

  • 52 Plus Joker Member
  • Extraordinaire
  • *
  • 1,071
    Posts
  • Reputation: 74
  • Encarded makes custom playing cards.

  • Facebook:

  • Kickstarter:

  • Twitter:

  • YouTube:
Soon. And yes, they are even better than the Exquisites...
Paul Carpenter
Designer - http://encarded.com

Tendril Ascendant & Nightfall  /  Standards /  Chancellor, Zenith, Deco, Aurum, Tendril: Sold Out
 

Re: Anti-KS : Encarded Zenith
« Reply #48 on: March 07, 2014, 10:57:22 PM »
 

Anthony

  • 52 Plus Joker Member
  • Haven Citizen
  • *
  • 1,150
    Posts
  • Reputation: 140
  • Growing old is Mandatory, Growing up is optional

  • Facebook:

  • Twitter:
Very nice..........the Tuck looks very interesting  ;)

Can't wait for more!
 

Re: Anti-KS : Encarded Zenith
« Reply #49 on: March 07, 2014, 11:01:13 PM »
 

Mike Ratledge

  • 52 Plus Joker Member
  • Discourse Lover
  • *
  • 237
    Posts
  • Reputation: 24
  • You only go around once - spin hard as you can!
I'm a little confused about using EPCC. I thought EPCC was using the Taiwanese manufacture now? I agree there is a huge difference between the Shanghai manufacture and Taiwanese. What are we talking about?

From what I understand EPCC finds companies from around the world to print high quality cards. So they use different factories for different wants/needs. I don't think EPCC "stopped" using the Shanghai printer, just hasn't used them since Global Titan. In Paul's case I would like to think he is using the Taiwan factory since he mentions Exquisite, which came out of the factory.

If anyone knows if this isn't the correct information, feel free to correct me :).
EPCC uses a Taiwanese factory and not one in Shanghai.  I just got a quote from him myself in the past few days and I'll have to say that the pricing is extraordinary.  They will be used in a future project that I'm working on now, and as Paul has noted - it's realistic to do a 1000 deck run without going to deep and anything over 2500 is looking like a price of 55-60% of what you would be paying for the same thing from USPCC with embossed & foiled tucks, metallic inks and custom seals coming in at a price that makes most people that have gotten quotes recently from USPCC using the "tuck case provider" cry.
« Last Edit: March 07, 2014, 11:01:53 PM by Ratledge »
> Mike <

Opinions are my own, your mileage WILL vary...

Announcing a new age of cooperation: PCF & UnitedCardists.com are now both owned by 52+Joker members!